Originally Posted by
gr3ybird
Multifunctionality. Same item, different uses, based on context or player input.
Example:
Wand of x detection. You are prompted for what you want to detect: items/monsters/traps. You very rarely detect things, one extra keypress won't kill you.
Wand of the door (stupid name) makes a door if pointed at an empty square, unlocks one if pointed at a locked one.
The idea is that Adom world is a lush place with a multitude of stuff that doesn't practically do anything for you.
If you are a barbarian that likes to smash things, you won't ever need glockenspiels or spellbooks simply because 99,9% of barbarians will never be in a situation to use them.
Note that virtually all wands have effects that can be reproduced with spells so there is a correlation that makes it easier to remember.
Having wands that do not translate to spells create a kind of a dissonance.
I happen to find lots of wands of door creation and few wands of knocking but it's fine because I use the former much more frequently than the latter.
I believe this variety in items and the rate at which they appear in the game reflects their general usefulness and I'd hate to lose that.
Wands of detection kinda work in a similar way, they replicate features that would otherwise be class specific.
Mindcrafter can detect monsters, wizards (and several other classes) can learn summon monsters and use it, thieves can detect traps very effectively, though other classes can learn and eventually master the respective skills/spells.
Combining wands together would be detrimental to the diversity of needs in the first half of the game.
It would be a cheap solution to what very few people consider an actual issue - namely inventory clogging.
However, only a little continuous maintenance is needed on player's part to have a very clean and easily accessible inventory.
But wait, you say, I like having 3 types of detection wands. Oh, well, you will love the alternate reality where there were wands of teleport self and teleport monster and teleport friendly npc.
This is really, really important, and I want you to listen to it: You like the way things are just because you are used to it, not because it's the best way to do things. If you were from the hypothetical world I just mentioned where there were 3 types of teleport wands, you would think that was best and having three different wands of detection was pointless. Get real here.
Separation of item functions is important but what you are suggesting with the alternate world and teleportation is going overboard.
You made a wrong comparison. When you detect stuff, you detect separate entities that are governed by independent set of rules.
Teleportation would have to be able to teleport items and chunks of walls or doors to make sense in your context.
Otherwise it's just one effect that is applicable to both the PC and NPC, hence it's only a single wand.
There is no Adom world where separating those effects makes sense, if we adhere to the game rules.
However separating detection effects does make sense because it pertains to different classes of objects, unlike teleportation.
Besides, wands of teleportation are quite powerful in what they allow the PC to achieve, versus detection stuff.
It's reasonable that there should be only a single type of teleportation wand but multiple wands with weaker effects.
Elimination of redundancy. Some items can be eliminated with absolutely no decrease in the number of meaningful player choices.
Example:
right now iirc, we have: potion of boost stat x 9. we could have this: melee potion(boosts str/to/wil), ranged potion(boosts dex, per), mage potion(boosts ma, will), social potion(boosts ap, chr). Less than half the number. If you tell me the game is any worse off for this you are lying. More people would actually use boost potions now because in one shot you would be able to get what you needed for a particular situation. It's fine if they are a little more powerful, because they are lousy now.
What you are proposing with the potions is simply wrong.
Each attribute has to be considered within its own scope and combining effects like you suggested would be very harmful to how customizable a character is and how players approach attribute management.
You're advocating mini-poga here, where the great variety of classes demands to have each attribute considered separately.
The classes aren't just melee/ranged/magic, there is a vast grey zone here which defies categorization and your idea would only damage that.
Take a case where a mindcrafter has reached willpower of 26 with morgia.
Now is the time to get to the maze and grab that mino emp corpse and 6 poga.
But wait, there are some stat potions with combined effects and he could use some more strength.
But no, he can't drink that potion because increasing strength along with willpower ends up a net loss of several Wi points after he eats the corpse and cannot retrain that with morgia anymore.
Simplification for the sake of reducing inventory clogging is implemented poorly here and overall, gameplay suffers.
This is just one example out of countless more, I bet I can counter your every suggestion in this department with an Adom character that would be at a disadvantage because of that.
That's why potions have to be separate for each attribute and this setup is superior.
And yes, I'm telling you the game would be worse with your suggestion and that's not a lie, it's an educated opinion.
Don't even get me started on ammo types with minor differences.
What if healing potions had tiny differences in amount healed that kept them from stacking in the inventory? Yeah, it's just as bad as that except *you are used to it* so you think it's a good idea.
Right now dungeon levels and pc inventory are so packed with junk you miss important things.
I absolutely agree that the excess of ammo variety is killing part of the fun.
This is however an ongoing issue, there have already been rfes that targeted this issue and as it is now, there are no variations of missiles of *foo* slaying right now.
They stack nicely so the idea is to extend this further over the rest of missiles or AT LEAST give the player the choice to force them to stack at the cost of losing the variety.
I'm sure this will be discussed again and addressed by TB.
Yes, I am used to the current situation but I don't think it's a good idea.
The same is true for most other items.
The best way I see, how this could be implemented, is to dramatically cut down on same item variations.
A broadsword (+1, 1d7+1) can exist in about a dozen or more variations, why not cut it down to 3?
It's funny, because a lot of people complain about how games in TES series have streamlined too much. But adom refuses to ever streamline anything. It. Never. Gives. Up. Any. Feature. Ever. There's no realization that things can ever be too complicated for their own good. And that's a problem.
EDIT: yeah, and alphabetical sorting within item subtypes would be ideal.
This is a roguelike. What you lack in graphics and sound effects you have to make up for with the complexity of mechanics.
If you think there are too many items, perhaps you should try a different game.
I personally think there aren't enough items in Adom but that's just me.
Watch people playing Adom on the server, watch _Ln_ and how he entertains his pack-rat nature while completely in control of all items he picks up and what is where in his inventory.
He never gets lost searching through multiple pages of items and does so with enviable fluidity.
Adom inventory management is a mini-game of its own and I'd hate to see that go. Learn it and it ceases to be a problem and starts to work to your advantage.
Yes, TES games have been watered down to cater to the mentally handicapped console population that can't handle games with too many features.
When I remember what Morrowind was like and then play Skyrim, it's so fucking disappointing. That's why I play Adom.
EDIT: Wow this has to be the biggest monstrosity of a post I've ever created. What a slab of text, sorry about that ;)