Missiles not stacking (again)
issueid=2841 04-19-2014 11:57 AM
Qui Qui is offline
Senior Member
Number of reported issues by Qui: 85
Missiles not stacking (again)

As a follow-up to this: http://www.adom.de/forums/project.php?issueid=2822

And just to make it clear: The only simple fix I see is to remove all variability for to-hit and to-damage from all missiles. If you want that please file a separate RFE. Personally I do not like the idea too much.
Well, I'd say yes to that. I already assumed the fix for p21 would concern all missiles, and I thought it was brilliant. Disappointed it was not so. The issue is, if someone's using archery often, and has autopickup missiles on, there will be oh so much rubbish in the inventory with single arrows with different to-hit, different damage, different status and prefixes... And they are basically unusable, because having to reload after one shot is tedious and dangerous. Having base to-hit and damage the same would make less rubbish and more meaningful stacks.

And on the flip side - +3/-3 differences in to-hit/damage aren't all meaningful. I think we can live without them. And actually prefixed missiles could matter more.
Issue Details
Issue Number 2841
Issue Type Feature
Project ADOM (Ancient Domains Of Mystery)
Category All
Status Implemented
Priority 5 - Medium
Suggested Version ADOM 1.2.0 pre 22
Implemented Version ADOM 2.3.0 (r73)
Milestone "Ease of Use" UI
Votes for this feature 18
Votes against this feature 0
Assigned Users (none)
Tags (none)




04-24-2014 09:17 PM
Senior Member
Also higher metal missiles should be identical. They are rare as it is, and splitting them into a little stacks wastes them. Usually they are not even shoot by anyone because of it.

04-25-2014 06:53 AM
Senior Member
All this sounds like too much coding for too little gain. I'd rather see the effort spent on new content for the game than adding a quiver.

I'd be happy with simply making all missiles standard--no bonuses or penalties. Or if you still want some variation, someone else suggested making all missiles generated by monsters shooting at you standard that would already help a lot.

04-25-2014 09:18 AM
Ancient Member
As people keep posting in this thread, I point you to the fact (which many of you may have overlooked) that the Creator has suggested a missile bundling mechanism in another thread:

http://www.adom.de/forums/project.php?issueid=2849

I think that would be a great solution.

04-25-2014 09:28 AM
Senior Member
Quote Originally Posted by Al-Khwarizmi
As people keep posting in this thread, I point you to the fact (which many of you may have overlooked) that the Creator has suggested a missile bundling mechanism in another thread:

http://www.adom.de/forums/project.php?issueid=2849

I think that would be a great solution.
Missiles will still clog an inventory. It will still require adding new missiles to the stack manually. Not a solution, imho.

04-25-2014 10:21 AM
Ancient Member
Quote Originally Posted by asdf
Missiles will still clog an inventory. It will still require adding new missiles to the stack manually. Not a solution, imho.
Well, to me the main problem is not inventory clogging (which is not a big issue with all the filters, etc. that have been implemented) but the tedium of reloading manually.

Marking the missiles manually shouldn't be too time-consuming, at least if you're not very perfeccionistic. I can see myself making a normal arrow bundle, a normal quarrel bundle, and slaying bundles. Or at most, splitting the normal bundle into "standard" and "extra quality" (high metals, winged, and stuff like that) bundles if I'm feeling picky that day.

Anyway, if people feel inventory clogging is also a big problem for them, it's always possible to combine both solutions (simplifying modifiers a bit + bundling). But to me bundling would be more important.

04-25-2014 07:14 PM
Ancient Member
The bundling idea is, imho, the best one if a quiver is not possible, since it's the closest thing to a quiver that you can get :).

Although i really hope a quiver is going to be implemented, since it's so much more cool and realistic. Also, in real life, quivers are not a bad defense for your back, so they should actually have a point or two of PV on a them too :P.

04-28-2014 08:28 AM
Senior Member
How about just making the quiver go in the cloak slot (or the tool slot), and all it does is take the reload_missiles time from 0.8s down to 0s?

I personally don't care about having a large missiles page in inventory, but I *do* care about having to waste turns changing missile stacks when i should be firing! :D

04-28-2014 08:35 AM
Ancient Member
Quote Originally Posted by sylph
I personally don't care about having a large missiles page in inventory, but I *do* care about having to waste turns changing missile stacks when i should be firing! :D
In contrast, I don't care that much about wasting turns. What I do care about is wasting real life time, and that playing an archer means more than 50% of the time is devoted to fiddling through the inventory changing arrows back and forth...

04-28-2014 08:53 AM
Senior Member
Quote Originally Posted by Al-Khwarizmi
In contrast, I don't care that much about wasting turns. What I do care about is wasting real life time, and that playing an archer means more than 50% of the time is devoted to fiddling through the inventory changing arrows back and forth...
Can't you just set Reload_Missiles to 'true', and all your problems are solved?
I don't lose any real-life time then I'm just hammering ty ty ty ty ty ty ty ty ty tyt ytyty ty ty ty t yty ty t, to fire off a barrage of a hundred arrows into a room full of goblins!

04-28-2014 09:07 AM
Ancient Member
Quote Originally Posted by sylph
Can't you just set Reload_Missiles to 'true', and all your problems are solved?
No because if I'm using standard ammo, I don't want to waste slaying ammo!

All my problems are solved if there is a way to set a set of missiles (but not necessarily all of them) to be auto-reloaded. I.e., what both the quiver and the bundling idea do.

04-28-2014 09:22 AM
Senior Member
Ah, I see. I always work around that by ctrl-D'ing all my slaying ammo before a fight, and I agree it can be a pain!

04-28-2014 10:02 AM
Qui Qui is offline
Senior Member
Personally I fail to understand the opposition to simply making all ordinary arrows (+0, 1d6). All those ideas with bundling or quivering don't really solve the problem of junk in inventory, and also would require manually marking all the single junk arrows. Which is admittedly better than the current state, but still annoying, and I'd still rather just throw them away.

On the other hand, the current to-hit/damage "variety" is purely superficial. In the early game, any missiles are good missiles. Later, those small bonuses/maluses are barely relevant. I'd say just get rid of them, and leave the variety to prefixes/suffixes/material/buc status, which still is plenty.

04-28-2014 10:05 AM
Senior Member
Quote Originally Posted by Qui
Personally I fail to understand the opposition to simply making all ordinary arrows (+0, 1d6). All those ideas with bundling or quivering don't really solve the problem of junk in inventory, and also would require manually marking all the single junk arrows. Which is admittedly better than the current state, but still annoying, and I'd still rather just throw them away.

On the other hand, the current to-hit/damage "variety" is purely superficial. In the early game, any missiles are good missiles. Later, those small bonuses/maluses are barely relevant. I'd say just get rid of them, and leave the variety to prefixes/suffixes/material/buc status, which still is plenty.
Seeing amount of discussion on this topic here, i'd now prefer simply making all missiles standard now too. We atleast could see if someone comes with a reason why he needs missile variety exactly.

04-28-2014 11:09 AM
Senior Member
Yep, I voted for it too.

I'd like to see a quiver or bag implemented for other reasons - mainly balance, so that throwing daggers, axes, or scurgari is a little more viable, because having to use a quiver/bag in the tool/cloak slot for rocks, arrows, and quivers would be a disadvantage. It's way beyond the scope of this RFE though, and there are many other balance concerns I'd rather see dealt with (spears). Overwhelmingly, though, I think we'll find that nobody would really mourn the loss of their 3x arrows (-1, 1d6+2). :)

04-28-2014 11:40 AM
Ancient Member
As there are several possible solutions and varying opinions, I have made a poll about people's preferred solution to the missile stacking/reloading problem: http://www.adom.de/forums/showthread...o-archery-woes

02-14-2015 03:26 AM
Senior Member
Since we have all those new prefixes and suffixes, variability of missile quality no longer serves its intended purpose, so it should be removed.

02-14-2015 01:39 PM
Ancient Member
What new prefixes and suffixes?

02-14-2015 06:31 PM
Senior Member
more precisely, old prefixes and suffixes that now apply to more types of ammo (i.e. sling bullets). Variability in stats serves absolutely the same purpose(creating variety in ammo), it is a duplicate feature so it should be removed.

02-14-2015 10:13 PM
Ancient Member
I don't see how it's duplicate, things like (+1,+1) and things like "of dragon slaying" do different things, they are different functionality.

Anyway, I think it's good that you bumped this thread. This issue deserves attention before the Steam public release IMO. Whether the chosen solution is to remove the variability or to add the some kind of marking/bundling (see poll link above), something should be done.

02-15-2015 01:27 AM
Senior Member
It is duplicate - there's "balanced", "barbed", "weighted", "of targeting" that cover exactly the same bonuses (only to a greater extent).

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