The Weakest Link 2010: Rules

[gut]

> should I hope people will behave in the spirit of the rule rather than
> looking for excuses to to skim the grey areas?

You can trust me

Based on my exp, I think 400 turns is all it takes to explore
most levels to my satisfaction. That's 5 descentions per turn.
If I play 'in the spirit', I could descend those 5 times and not
feel bad about it. What you may consider a grey area (descending
with 100 turns left), I may consider adaquate time to explore
a good chunk of the next level.

Gimme that 100 turn restriction!

[Molach]

No alert. Speed is a pretty all-round decent trait.

Talents depend a bit on char, though. And I just realized, if one wants to do it, one has to first generate a char first, randomly, then report what char it was. Since you need to allocate talents before saving you throw away that char, and later on make another, by selecting same race and class.

IF this was a solo challenge game - you must go as deep in the ID as possible, and descend at least once every 2000-turn segment - would anyone seriously dive down 5 levels by round 2000? First five I would definately take as slow as possible. Food considerations could be a major worry, but oterwise you gain everything by going slower. Milking rockthrowers, gaining exp, getting weapon skills, training normal skills, finding more stuff.

At some point, this play will lead to increased chance of death instead, but levels 1-5 are gold to any harvester.

I wouldn't. But then again I'm not an expert IDiver

[Grey]

No alert. Speed is a pretty all-round decent trait.

Talents depend a bit on char, though. And I just realized, if one wants to do it, one has to first generate a char first, randomly, then report what char it was. Since you need to allocate talents before saving you throw away that char, and later on make another, by selecting same race and class.

I did this for the semi-finals and finals last year. To be honest I think it's a waste of time, since talents affect everyone pretty much equally, and you have no control over what talents other people pick during play. I may do this again for the final, but for the initial rounds it'll just slow down the start way too much.

In Duel to the Death I always went with the talents Long Stride, Quick, Very Quick, Greased Lightning, Hardy, Very Hardy (well, none ever got further than 4, but that was my theoretical order). The only exception were bards - I gave them SLBs and then Hardy talents. Even Raven characters benefit well from these talents, and they affect everyone pretty much equally, so I think it's fair to use this. Overall the talents don't make a huge deal of difference though. Also I must say I'm against giving PV talents to chars initially, since that restricts chaotic actions a bit.

The other option would be to give the char entirely useless talents, but that seems less fun to me. Speed-based talents can open up extra playstyles for the characters, and the important ability to run away (ever necessary), making the game less predictable.

[vogonpoet]

-My opponent gives me a completely explored level, I'm standing on the stairs. I have full HP. We have 3 large rations in our inventory. I w5 for 1999 turns, eating all three large rations in the process, then descend. Chaotic or no? What if I only have to eat 2 of the three rations?

-I've descended once already and find the stairs on turn 1500. I descend immediately, then spend the next 500 turns cooking some extra corpses, bookcasting bless to train Ma and Concentration (and stacking blessings). Chaotic or no? What if I do my cooking and casting on the level above for 499 turns, then descend on the last one?

Hang on Grey, you said the first of these - "destroy all food, gain zero explortation (of opponents level)" *might* be considered chaotic, but "make loads of food, build spellcasting capacity, stack blessings, gain zero exploration (of opponents level)" is definitely totally chaotic and bad, cos like, being blessed with loads of food really sucks compared to having no blessing and no food?

I hope that if and when a potentially chaotic descent ()is made in the actual tournament, the decision to DQ or not is given a bit more time and consideration.

[Timpak]

No alert. Speed is a pretty all-round decent trait.

Talents depend a bit on char, though. And I just realized, if one wants to do it, one has to first generate a char first, randomly, then report what char it was. Since you need to allocate talents before saving you throw away that char, and later on make another, by selecting same race and class.

IF this was a solo challenge game - you must go as deep in the ID as possible, and descend at least once every 2000-turn segment - would anyone seriously dive down 5 levels by round 2000? First five I would definately take as slow as possible. Food considerations could be a major worry, but oterwise you gain everything by going slower. Milking rockthrowers, gaining exp, getting weapon skills, training normal skills, finding more stuff.

At some point, this play will lead to increased chance of death instead, but levels 1-5 are gold to any harvester.

I wouldn't. But then again I'm not an expert IDiver

The first five you would not take it slow, it takes just like gut says around 400 turns to fully explore a level unless you encounter something special. Staying much longer on a level would only mean less food which could turn out to be a problem. I don't know what you are going to do other than stand around just w5 w5 after you have fully explored the level and killed everything.

[vogonpoet]

Like he says - milking stuff - milking summoners, milking rockthrowers... sure, you wouldn't w5, and you might skip an unnecessary corridor if you were worried about a door trap, but in general it doesn't pay to rush through the lower levels - full exploration is generally better, as large rations are just as likely to be generated in the room furthest from the stairs as they are in the room next to the stairs... and lots of people in the TWL tournaments always claim that diving 10 levels in search of food is way better than exploring fully 4 levels frinstance...

[JellySlayer]

The first five you would not take it slow, it takes just like gut says around 400 turns to fully explore a level unless you encounter something special. Staying much longer on a level would only mean less food which could turn out to be a problem. I don't know what you are going to do other than stand around just w5 w5 after you have fully explored the level and killed everything.

Well, monsters regenerate, so you can just kill more of them...

and lots of people in the TWL tournaments always claim that diving 10 levels in search of food is way better than exploring fully 4 levels frinstance...

I think it is, strictly speaking, marginally better. Full exploration will require you to go over the same squares more than once, which is less efficient for finding a floor drop. Likewise, if you drop to a lower level, you might get a tension room or something that would generally be likely to give you food. Not that I'm necessarily advocating this as a general strategy, but if it's a starvation lottery situation where literally every turn counts, then you're probably better off diving.

[Grey]

Hang on Grey, you said the first of these - "destroy all food, gain zero explortation (of opponents level)" *might* be considered chaotic, but "make loads of food, build spellcasting capacity, stack blessings, gain zero exploration (of opponents level)" is definitely totally chaotic and bad, cos like, being blessed with loads of food really sucks compared to having no blessing and no food?

The stickler is the descending at the end of the turn. As others seem perfectly able to grasp (I think Molach said it best of all) you should be playing as you normally would. Ultimately I'd say that precludes both situations - descending suddenly at the end of your turn is unnatural, and so is w5ing and using up all the food. To be honest I think anyone doing the latter will be booed out of the competition... If people don't want to actually *play* then they shouldn't join the game.

[Grey]

I think it is, strictly speaking, marginally better. Full exploration will require you to go over the same squares more than once, which is less efficient for finding a floor drop. Likewise, if you drop to a lower level, you might get a tension room or something that would generally be likely to give you food. Not that I'm necessarily advocating this as a general strategy, but if it's a starvation lottery situation where literally every turn counts, then you're probably better off diving.

Probably more than marginally better. But diving is certainly a lot worse for increasing the danger to the character, which makes for much greater starvation issues. Not being able to kill enemies makes it much harder to find food. It's also safer to explore more of the level when you know where the down stairs room is than to plunge downwards and so cut off any chance of retreat. Ultimately diving for food should only be done if starvation is an immediate concern, which isn't likely to be the case during the first two rounds.

[gut]

Good grief. How hard is it to post hard rules. Here, I'll do it:

- You must descend at least once per round, yet no more than 4 times per round.
- No descending in the last 100 turns of your round, unless it's your only descent.

There, two lines and everybody is happy.
Leave all this 'unless it's for a good reason' junk behind.