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Thread: The Weakest Link 2010: Rules

  1. #1
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    Default The Weakest Link 2010: Rules

    Post in this thread if you have any questions about the rules or nature of the game.

    The Weakest Link competition was started in 2008 as an offshoot of Silfir's "Roman Republic" game idea (which I believe was itself somewhat a product of Soirana's "Democracy" games on the Brinkster forums). Due to the popularity of TWL it has now become an annual event. The rules have been tweaked each year as situations demand, and in response to some issues that were raised last year there are now a few new tweaks. However everything remains largely the same.

    The Premise:

    A character will be created that goes straight to the infinite dungeon, the intention being to see how deep it can go and how well people can survive. Each player gets control of the PC for 2000 turns. During that time they must descend by at least one level. When they have finished they save the game, post the save here along with a complete report of what's happened, and the next person picks up the save game and continues for 2000 turns. As the game goes on the PC will go deeper and deeper in the ID, and sooner or later everyone will start dying gruesome deaths.

    If you die then you are The Weakest Link - goodbye! You're out of the game and the next person on the list must then pick up from before you played and try to survive the same encounters. Post the highscore details from your death (no flgs though) and you'll be entered onto a group high score table. Eventually everyone will start dying away, and it'll be left to a couple of very skilled or very lucky players trying desperately to survive in the depths of infinity. Finally all will inevitably die, as the ID kills everyone in the end.

    The game will be structured into several leagues, and the winners from each league will then play against each other in one big final game. There'll obviously be a touch of pride in coming out top, but I'll give a little bonus reference to whoever manages the most stupid or amusing death too.

    Summary of the Rules:

    -descend at least one dungeon level during your round
    -no use of the up stairs (the one exception being if there's an impassable river - then you can quickly <>)
    -do not exceed the turn limit of 2000 by more than 50 - try not to exceed it at all! (the tactical display will be changed to show number of moves instead of speed)
    -give a post describing your activities after your round, including important info like using up prayers, items found and monsters encountered that could affect future players
    -you have 48 hours to play when it comes to your turn - if you don't at least post during this time then you'll be knocked back in the playing order and disqualified if another 48 hours pass
    -no competitive hindering tactics allowed during the first 2 rounds
    -any and all competitive and dirty tactics allowed on round 3 or after
    -if you die you just have to post to say you died - no details are necessary until the next person survives, but we expect a full report at some point
    -lastly, have fun - this game relies mostly on luck, with a little bit of skill; try to enjoy it and don't take things too seriously

    These rules are not all strictly enforced - they mostly rely on faith in the player, just as we have faith that people posting YAVPs haven't save-scummed. If you break the rules in any way and then lie about it, then the only loser is you.

    Notes on Competitive Play:

    After 2 rounds have passed players can start using competitive tactics to increase their chances and reduce the chances of others. For instance, a player could throw away a good melee weapon or armour because they think they can survive better than other players without it. Or someone (unnamed) could deliberately doom the PC because they think it'll improve their survival chances compared to everyone else. There are no restrictions on what you can do to damage the PC in the hopes of it giving you a competitive edge after the first 2 rounds have played out, as long as it's within the rules stated above. However you cannot deliberately benefit from withholding information about the PC! All actions that could affect other players must be noted in the game report after your turn - no hiding info about monsters around the corner, stuff you've cursed, etc. There will be no mercy for those that benefit from information that was not fully disclosed.

    Also, should you create an unsolvable situation then you're out of the game and everyone continues on from before your turn. What this means is that if everyone after you dies from your dirty tactics, and then the file comes back to you and you die too, then you are The Weakest Link, goodbye! So be careful with extreme competitive tactics - they could back-fire. On the other hand, this is the most stylish way to win if you do manage to survive.

    Competitive play is not allowed during the first two rounds. You are expected to play as you normally would, and your team-mates will call you out on anything they deem to be chaotic. However it is not expected for you to scum everything to perfection and play a perfect game, and you are allowed to use resources to enhance your survival as necessary. Still, I will state clearly that diving more than 5 levels during the first two rounds will be considered chaotic unless there are some very good reasons. Even 5 levels is extreme, and will be put to question. Also waiting on the stairs and descending on your last move without reason will now be considered a chaotic act, and so banned for the first two rounds. You may only descend in this way if you have a clear motive (such as a dangerous monster appearing, or needing to descend at least once during your turn).

    Tiebreaks:

    A league is won by being the last player to survive - ie. everyone else dies horribly and you survive the last turn. If there is no clear winner of a league (both final players die) then the result is chosen by the tiebreak conditions. The first condition is that whoever dived deepest wins. If both died on the same level then whoever scored the most xp wins. If that is equal then it comes down to whoever lasted the most moves. So dungeon level > xp > moves. This only applies to a situation where both players are dead.

    The Final:

    The final will consist of one winner from each league (no runners-up any more, and no semi-finals - this is to shorten the competition and encourage more competition when only the league is whittled down to the last two). It will be played out as a normal league. The initial placement in the playing order will be decided by who got deepest in the ID during their league match (with the deepest-diving getting to pick placement first). This is to encourage some semblance of cooperation between league members during the first round, as it will benefit that league's winner.

    River Rule:

    If there is a river on the level and the downstairs are blocked and you have no realistic means of crossing within your turn then you may quickly regenerate the level. This means making a beeline for the stairs without engaging in fights or picking up items and quickly doing a <> to create a new level. This does not count towards the requirement to descend at least once on your turn. It's up to the player to decide whether he thinks the river to be passable or not. You need not generate the level yourself to invoke the rule (ie if you pick up the save on the river level and find it too difficult to overcome then you may regenerate the level, as long as you still descend another level during your turn).

    The Abyss:

    If you create an impassable situation (one in which everyone dies, including yourself when it comes back round) then you will be cast into the Abyss and out of the game. All other members of the league will be revived and will start again from before your turn. The save will also be opened up to dead people to try, with a small chance for them to take your place in the league (I'll go into more detail about this if the situation arises).

    Reporting:

    Complete and clear reporting is necessary for the good of the game. Firstly it makes it more interesting for everyone that's watching (this is a spectator sport after all). Secondly it ensures that the next player starts on a fair footing. If he loses because you presented information wrongly or incompletely then you are to blame. It's best to give a complete report and attach a log file. Better yet, record a video with CamStudio (see Silfir's video thread for a setting guide). Hiding chaotic actions is particularly disallowed. Any chaotic actions you take must be fully reported so spectators know exactly what's going on. It's not enough to give unclear details and expect others to work it out by themselves.

    There is no excuse for vague or incomplete reports. Unfamiliarity with the language or lack of time will not be accepted - reporting is part of the game, so if you have time to play you will make time to give a good report. Repeated failures on this part will get you removed from the game.

    If it is your turn and you feel the prior report is not clear enough then do not play - ask for further details and wait.


    Changes since last year:

    Just to make clear for everybody...
    - 48 hour play limit, with knockbacks in the queue for those who are late, and disqualification for those who are more late (though you can always post to request more time)
    - hard limit on level diving during non-chaos rounds
    - descending on final move without good cause is considered chaotic
    - harsher judgement of incomplete reports
    - only league winners ascend to the final
    Last edited by Grey; 05-20-2010 at 05:05 PM.
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  2. #2
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    SWEET ASS WEAKEST LINK YEAH

    descending at the very end of your turn will be considered chaotic
    Where did that come from? I can't leave an unexplored level to the next player? Or I can, but I have to first descend, then dick around for 500 turns letting the breeders breed and the corruptions traps produce purple jellys of fun, instead of the other way around? Or what exactly is the point of this? If this rule is telling me that I have to explore, or "sort of" explore levels for my successors, risking my own life in the process, then I shall have to proclaim "Screw this rule, I have green hair". Put in other words: Please explain what is chaotic about this?

    It can't just be that Soirana is doing it. Not everything Soirana does is chaotic. I mean, it's not a bad indicator, but not everything.
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    This comes from the tactic last year of everyone descending at the very end of their turn. One person even did it *after* their turn (they went over by a little bit). It's a sneaky way of forcing the next player to have to explore more dangerous surroundings, without any risk during your own turn.

    You're still allowed to descend as you wish during your turns, but deliberately waiting on the stairs till turn 1999 and then descending is now banned, with the one exception being if you haven't yet descended during your turn. I consider it a dirty and cowardly tactic, and so will only approve of it once the chaos gate is opened.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Silfir View Post
    SWEET ASS WEAKEST LINK YEAH



    Where did that come from? I can't leave an unexplored level to the next player? Or I can, but I have to first descend, then dick around for 500 turns letting the breeders breed and the corruptions traps produce purple jellys of fun, instead of the other way around? Or what exactly is the point of this? If this rule is telling me that I have to explore, or "sort of" explore levels for my successors, risking my own life in the process, then I shall have to proclaim "Screw this rule, I have green hair". Put in other words: Please explain what is chaotic about this?

    It can't just be that Soirana is doing it. Not everything Soirana does is chaotic. I mean, it's not a bad indicator, but not everything.
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    >waiting on the stairs till turn 1999 and then descending

    So, 1899 is cool?
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    One should have a reason for waiting around and then descending, or it may be interpreted as chaotic action.

    Caveat to the rules: If you think something might be considered breaking the rules then don't do it. Otherwise don't cry if you get kicked out of the competition.
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  7. #7
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    In the way you designed this rule, now the best strategy is to explore one level, wait for 1999 turns, then descend - that's perfectly legal, after all - forever destroying any incentive to play more than one level at all - you are now actively punished for even exploring the second! If this catches on, we may have a Finals league winner by Christmas Eve (I predict Soirana gets disqualified in the Finals, sometime in October). Is that what you want? Things to go even slower?

    It's a sneaky way of forcing the next player to have to explore more dangerous surroundings, without any risk during your own turn.
    What exactly is sneaky about it? My opponent gets a completely untouched, unexplored level, and has to fight his way through it. Well yes, that is sort of what he signed up to do, right? No one can know, or influence, what the unexplored level contains. It's pure RNG. Of course it's more dangerous than an explored level, otherwise we wouldn't be doing a damned competition about who can face that danger. The very first player starts out in an unexplored level. Is that unfair? Shouldn't you pre-explore that first level so that the first player gets to enjoy the same treatment as anyone else? Of course not. How does it become unfair just because I descended more than one smelly level? If you're afraid of the game becoming more dangerous too quickly... Well, it's the bloody Infinite Dungeon, not Fluffy Kitten Dungeon. You already restricted the maximum number of descends. That's enough.

    "Without any risk during your own turn" - I went out of my way to explore an extra level to add a little excitement to the game (or was forced to because I had to create more monsters more quickly to kill for food) and that somehow wasn't risky? Exploring that extra level that allows the situation we're talking about to occur is in itself risky, but on top of that you've got the Abyss rule, remember? THAT is your failsafe against overly hyperactive descenders and creators of impossible situations. The "sneaky" method of having the opponent do his own bloody work I didn't explore the stairs just so you could have bloody vacation causes a risk of an Abyss situation to occur, while gut's method - giving the opponent a fully explored level by not descending, hoping he is dumb enough to spend the following 2000 turns doing more than just descending and twiddling thumbs for a bit - all but completely avoids any chance to fall into the Abyss, and so is less risky.

    If you think something might be considered breaking the rules then don't do it. Otherwise don't cry if you get kicked out of the competition.
    Fat lot of good that does me! If I can't for the life of me figure out why something that feels perfectly natural, fair, and has always been present and accepted in past competitions is suddenly bad, what are my chances with anything else?

    The Chaos Gate is closed. That doesn't mean the Infinite Dungeon becomes My Little Ponies Land. It's not too much to expect of any player, even the very, very new ones, to play a bleeding unexplored Infinite Dungeon level. Unless it is your intention to force every player during the first Chaos Gate stage to play one level per 2000 turns. If so, just post that restriction along with the rules proper so we've got something solid to calculate with. I'm looking forward to Christmas Eve already.
    Last edited by Silfir; 05-20-2010 at 01:41 AM.
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  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grey View Post
    One should have a reason for waiting around and then descending, or it may be interpreted as chaotic action.

    Caveat to the rules: If you think something might be considered breaking the rules then don't do it. Otherwise don't cry if you get kicked out of the competition.
    Okay, let me see if I can try to clarify this:

    -I've already descended three levels. I find the stairs down on turn 1998 and immediately descend without waiting on the stairs. I take one step on turn 1999 to start exploring the new level and end my turn. Chaotic or no?

    -I'm playing a dark elf fighter. I've descended once already and find the second stairs on turn 1500, but I'm relatively low on health. I wait 499 turns to recover a measly 9 HP, then descend. Chaotic or no?

    -I'm playing a dark elf fighter. I've descended once already and find the second stairs on turn 1500, but I'm relatively low on health. I descend, but on the next level there's a locked door in the room that might have a fireball trap. I wait 500 turns to recover a measly 9 HP because I don't want to get exploded. Chaotic or no? What if the door isn't trapped, but I hear a vortex on the level? What if there door isn't locked, and I don't hear anything, but I wait to recover HP anyway?

    -My opponent gives me a completely explored level, I'm standing on the stairs. I have full HP. We have 3 large rations in our inventory. I w5 for 1999 turns, eating all three large rations in the process, then descend. Chaotic or no? What if I only have to eat 2 of the three rations?

    -I've descended once already and find the stairs on turn 1500. I descend immediately, then spend the next 500 turns cooking some extra corpses, bookcasting bless to train Ma and Concentration (and stacking blessings). Chaotic or no? What if I do my cooking and casting on the level above for 499 turns, then descend on the last one?

    -I've descended once already and find the stairs on turn 1800. I'm at full strength, and have enough food. I w5 on the stairs until turn 1999, but on that turn a greater daemon appears one square away from me. Is it chaotic if I either 1) don't descend, so that the greater daemon will be next to us and will follow the next player down the stairs, or 2) descend to avoid the greater daemon, but generate a new level.
    Last edited by JellySlayer; 05-20-2010 at 04:16 AM.
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  9. #9
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    - unnecessary descending at end of turn now deemed a chaotic action
    Yeah, thus is stupid, and will lead to unnecessary flames and confusion - are we going to set a bare minimum percentage of a level that must be explored for it be a non-chaotic act to descend twice in your turn?

    Ditch this rule, and be happy with the 5 level cap.

    I like the 5 level cap, cause it minimises the "oh I had to descend 10 levels to find some food, but yeah, actually, I only explored 2 rooms on each level, but yeah, its totally not chaotic to be hungry, and everyone knows food in the ID is only ever generated in the same room as the upstairs" bullshit (I mean bullshit), whilst at the same time giving the dudes who go first enough stuff to do to avoid boredom.

    /not bitter

    edit:
    It's a sneaky way of forcing the next player to have to explore more dangerous surroundings, without any risk during your own turn.
    Yeah, I'm with the Silf, this is clearly not sneaky, but is basically the point of holding the WL in the ID - it generates random dungeons. Furthermore, if you have descended at least once already, staying on the upstairs rather than descending again can reasonably be said to be a valid play - you get to generate a new non death-guaratneed dungeoun if the players after you all die, leaving subsequent multiple deaths up to the RNG rather than a situation you made yourself. So yeah, its stupid
    Last edited by vogonpoet; 05-20-2010 at 06:26 AM. Reason: Addendum

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    I was last year's unfortunate victim of what gray is trying to avoid here. The player before I went over his turn by a handful of turns and had already satisfied the one level descent requirement. However, once he realized he was over, he still took the extra turn to go down anyway instead of saving immediately and giving me the save file. His mistake cost him the right to leave me in a fresh deeper level.

    However, that being said, i'm all about waiting for 1999 and going down to leave the char at 2000 on a brand new level... Hell, i did it every turn i played, and i think is more than welcome and to be expected really. But if you accidentally go over, then you right to do so is revoked, since saving and passing is the higher priority.

    Therefore, i believe that the unnecessary descending at end of turn now deemed a chaotic action rule should be removed. In my opinion, every one of JellySlayer's scenarios would be non-chaotic and should be legit.
    Last edited by CheatMan; 05-20-2010 at 07:42 AM. Reason: horrible grammar

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