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Thread: don't mess with cat lord

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  1. #1
    Join Date
    May 2010
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    Poland
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    Default don't mess with cat lord

    i was reminded recently why you do not mess with cat lord. i had awesome human pally. crowned with Justifier, and with Serpent's bite in second hand was destroying everything in his path. with about 40 str he one-shoted ACW in ToEF (my first ever character who managed this). so when i was facing kitty lord i was pretty confident. i even disabled that damn cat. he was severly wounded with human slaying missiles. so when i ran out of those nice missiles i decided to finish him in melee. turns out it was no me finishing. you miss the invisible cat lord, you miss the invisible cat lord. cat lord hits you gazillion times. you die. i hate this bastard. and overconfidence when your character is getting really awesome ;-)
    When in danger, when in doubt, run in circles, scream and shout!

  2. #2
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    Mar 2008
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    Dual-wielding against the cat lord is a rather bad idea :/
    Platinum Edition ADOMer
    http://gamesofgrey.com - check out my roguelikes!

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grey View Post
    Dual-wielding is a rather bad idea :/
    Fixed that for you.

    Emphasis being, of course, on the "rather". Mostly, you can smash apart monsters however you feel like it. I have a hard time thinking of cases in which dual-wielding is the mathematically best option. I think only two might exist at all:

    a) Early game Ranger (they sometimes hit much better, thanks to their innate bonus, if they wield two weapons, provided the off-hand weapon is light enough)
    b) Needle & Sting (which no one cares about, or better, should care about)

    Even if you don't actually own a shield and would have to leave the second hand free, there is the benefit of usually higher to-hit chances, the ability to use the more powerful weapon more often and most importantly shorter intervals between actions (1 attack for 700 energy points, to me, is superior to 2 attacks for 1200 or even 1100 for that reason alone. ESPECIALLY if the one attack is Justifier). In a game in which much of a character's power lies in the ability to carry and immediately use obscene amounts of items and switch between tactics or means of attack in instant, the damage-per-energy-point value would have to be quite a bit superior!

    If you do have a shield, there's no excuse. To counter all that DV you miss out on, you would need a truly obscene difference in damage. Only Needle & Sting with their dual-wield-exclusive damage and to-hit bonus provide anything close to it. Even then, it's debatable.

    The only real question is, of course, why I felt the need to write this lecture on why dual-wielding is terrible right at this moment. I think it might have to do with a lack of ADOM-related flamewars.
    Last edited by Silfir; 09-22-2011 at 03:36 PM.
    ADOM Guides - whatever you wanted to know about playing a certain class, but have been afraid to ask!

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  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Silfir View Post
    The only real question is, of course, why I felt the need to write this lecture on why dual-wielding is terrible right at this moment. I think it might have to do with a lack of ADOM-related flamewars.
    Ok.. I will contradict you for the sake of it, then.

    I think more people should try dual wielding, actually. It is fun and it is viable. I know because I tried.

    Will spam more crap here later, dinner is ready. Oh and to the OP, sorry for your loss, the cat lord is a real bastard.
    You steal a scroll labelled HITME. The orc hits you.

  5. #5
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    "Fun"? "Viable"? Now who in their right mind would care about that? It doesn't really contradict "It's a bad idea" either. Some of the most fun ideas in the history of ideas have been exceptionally bad, and pretty much any way to play ADOM is "viable", except perhaps playing without the arrow keys. If it weren't for moving to the Tower and back, you could probably take one of the four directions away; like, never use the numpad or arrow keys related to 3, 6 and 9 (east). If you restrict it to dungeons only, it's probably doable, actually. Get some teleport and you should be fine (not that you could move the teleport cursor to the right, but random teleporting is allowed). Does ":s" ask for a prompt if there is only one creature to switch places with? I sort of lost track now. Where am I? What day is it? I like pudding.
    Last edited by Silfir; 09-22-2011 at 05:18 PM.
    ADOM Guides - whatever you wanted to know about playing a certain class, but have been afraid to ask!

    Check out my youtube channel to see my ADOM videos, including a completed playthrough of the game. I try to give instructions, so if you want to see some place you haven't been before and get some hints on how to deal with it, this might help! There's also some other games featured there that you might find interesting.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
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    Ok, I will put it sharper. Dual wielding is crazy powerful and can shoot your damage output through the roof. I found you need to take care of two things, basically:

    1. In the beginning of the game, your low DV will mean you need to play extra careful (later on, better equipment and weapon skills largely compensate).
    2. Raise your dual wielding skill to 100 as fast as you can.

    If you follow those two guidelines, I found that dual wielding makes you a killing machine in the mid to late game.

    You mentioned high energy cost. Compare it to mighty blow and tremendous blow.. those are regarded as good skills, right?

    As for lack of shield.. if two handed weapons like vanquisher, the cow axe, wyrmlance and the RCT are seen as good, that must mean that giving up a shield can be good.
    You steal a scroll labelled HITME. The orc hits you.

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