Chaos Knight Alignment Changing and Eternal Guardian

[Superteeth]

Hello everyone. It has been a while since I have posted, but I recently got back into ADOM after finding that a new, fancy version with graphics was made. Since starting to play, I have decided for the first time to stop being a habitual save-scummer and actually (try) to play the game legitimately. I currently have a very promising Dwarven Chaos Knight that I have switched to neutral alignment to gain access to many useful things.

He is currently on level 21, and has yet to do the ToEF or even venture past the animated forest. I had been scumming the big room non-stop for the past two days in the hope of getting a ring of djinni summoning or amulet of life saving, but have had no luck (I have picked up many potions of stat raising, though). I am going for a normal chaos god ending, and it would be nice if my first legitimate win was such an ending. I even found Celestrix in the Water Dragon Cave, and contrary to what the guidebook says, it is quite the nice artifact. I have both intrinsic and item luck and fate smiles, along with two rings of luck, so I think it more or less cancels out the doom effect of the girdle.

Now to the question: I want to take advantage of the full corruption removal from Yrruir, which obviously requires one to be at level 30. I also have to be at least neutral to do so. I also want the Axe of the Minotaur Emperor, because it would be cool to get the Spiked Armor of Chaos and Terror as my crowning gift and go around slaughtering everything with the axe and armor equipped. As you all know, the Minotaur Maze is terribly difficult, so I want to be on as high a level as possible before going there. Now, what is the fastest way for a character who does not care about alignment to level up? The Eternal Guardian.

I was thinking of going down to the Eternal Guardian while neutral, killing as many copies as it takes to get to level 29 (at least something less than 30, but higher than 21), going back to the surface, navigating the maze and killing the Minotaur Emperor more or less at my leisure, switching back to neutral (at which point, I would theoretically be at level 30), getting the quest to help Yrruir, and removing all the corruption I had incurred up to that point. At this point I would switch back to chaotic, get crowned, and do whatever I wanted. However, between removing the corruption and switching back to chaotic, I would like to show the Ring of the High Kings to the Eternal Guardian so that I could use the shortcut (while being neutral, of course).

Another question: Does the piety you gain with a deity of a different alignment stay the same (minus the decay over time) if you switch alignments? Is it still possible to be crowned chaotic if you are in good standing with the neutral or lawful deity?

Is this an option for a Chaos Knight, or will the Eternal Guardian be eternally pissed off at a Chaos Knight for attacking him? Also, will it be an issue with the Yrruir quest to constantly switch alignments? I know these may seem like stupid questions, but I really do not want to mess up this guy. Thanks in advance for any help.

[Stingray1]

Well, if you kill a few copies of the EG you will be at C-. It is a lot of work to get back to NC from C- at those lvls. I cannot however remember whether the new EGs are non-hostile, I think they are, because they remain on the stairs, don't they? If so, your plans can work.

You can crown with one deity if you are also in good standing with the others as far as I know.

I don't think there will be any issues with the unicorn quest as long as you are not of chaotic alignment when first meeting him or returning to him to claim your reward.

[Superteeth]

Well, from what I understand after reading the guidebook, if you, say, shoot at the Eternal Guardian, he does not move off the stairs. He makes hostile copies to fight you, and the real guardian stays on the stairs and remains neutral.

About the changing of alignment: I am fairly certain that if my memory does not fail me I was level 16 when I switched from the extreme chaotic alignment of a chaos knight to NC in Dwarftown by sacrificing 1 gold at a time. Theoretically, this should work no matter what level you are on, correct? I imagine the only difference would be how much gold you would have to sacrifice one at a time. I know I could not whip myself to bring my alignment up because of too much toughness, nor do I have any pets to heal while they drown (as chaotic as that actually is). If my plan goes, well, according to plan, I will have killed enough copies to bring myself to level 29. Is it extremely difficult to change alignment at that point? Thanks for the help, Stingray1.

[Stingray1]

From what I remember, I shoot the EG, he steps of the stairs to come kill me, then he laughs after the next turn as another copy appears on the stairs which is stronger than the previous one.

Maybe someone else knows better than me about sacrificing on a non-aligned altar, I have never attempted this at higher levels. I wonder what happened here, although he was at lvl 44.

[Superteeth]

I guess the general idea is correct though, as I believe that the one on the stairs is always neutral.

I feared that would be an issue. I noticed that as I was sacrificing 1 gold piece at a time on the Dwarftown altar, the ground kept rumbling every single time. Also, it was Andor Drakon that was "deeply appreciating" the single gold pieces I was sacrificing, not Clamgaddin. However, I did eventually shift to NC after maybe 300 gold. Maybe the guy you linked had an issue since he was changing from chaotic to lawful? Or maybe it is because of his high level, in which case I may have an issue.

I guess it is a risk I will have to thoroughly consider. Is the corruption removal from Yrruir worth it if it is only being used to remove maybe 5 corruptions at most, right before switching to an incorrigible chaotic being? I am not so sure anymore. Thanks again.

[_Ln_]

Minotaur Maze is not difficult, just tedious. I don't see your PV/DV and stats, but nothing except minotaur emperor hits truly hard in the Maze.

You can't spawn RoDSes in the big room, as it is too low level. You will need at least one scroll of danger to make it possible to spawn rings there. Waiting for AoLS to drop is even worse, as they are very rare, especially when you need them.

When you shoot EG, he will move from the stairs. The very next turn after he moved from the stairs a neutral copy of him will appear. The one you shot will be hostile and neutral EG won't talk to you until you kill all hostile copies.

IIRC the EG won't let converted Chaos Knights pass through and you'll have to resort to teleportation or violence irregardless of your alignment.

You shouldn't be C whenever you enter white unicorn's glade as she may take an aggresive stance. Other than that you should be fine. I don't know whether she actually does something for converted Chaos Knights.

Also, an important question - how are you going to take on EG? Unless you know what you're doing, you will be in deep trouble as he is very powerful.

[Stingray1]

>I guess it is a risk I will have to thoroughly consider. Is the corruption removal from Yrruir worth it if it is only being used to remove maybe 5 corruptions at most, right before switching to an incorrigible chaotic being? I am not so sure anymore.

Remember, ChAoS=POWER

[Superteeth]

These are my stats while "Strained!" and in "Normal" mode: DV=40, PV=35. I have a hefty eternium two-handed sword, and can switch to a crappy one-handed weapon plus a crystal tower shield. 30 Strength, 18 Learning, 24 Willpower, 33 Dexterity, 24 Toughness, 329 health, and nothing else is really relevant for a chaos knight. I have one corruption, very light, which hit my strength and toughness hard, but the speed (147) will help to run circles around the guardian (along with my blessed seven league boots). I could hit and run, or I could use my longbow with arrows of slaying (I have found no humanoid slayers). If I switch to chaotic before fighting the guardian, I will get the weapon skill randomizing skill, and will get 1d21 speed every turn in addition to the 147. For this reason, I do not think that the guardian will be the problem.

I saw that the guidebook said that the Eternal Guardian would not let chaotic knights past (more specifically, he would not let you past as long as you were chaotic). It did not say whether he would let neutral ones past. If I have to fight the guardian regardless of alignment, then it makes no difference what I do. Best to be chaotic to get my +2 stats back (do they come back?) and to have the abilities. What would be the alternative to fighting him if he does not let me by while neutral? He is apparently teleportation resistant, and if I teleport straight to the stairs in the time between him coming off and creating the copy, wouldn't he get a chance to hit me real hard (since he would be right next to the stairs?)

Also, about the big room, it was generated on D:6, and I have read two scrolls of danger (one uncursed, the other of unknown status, since I did not want the danger level to be too high). The code-dived information stated that an uncursed one raises DL by 2d2, so this should have been enough by itself. Thanks for chiming in, _Ln_. By the way, Stingray1, since I am hopefully going to remove the corruption using Yrruir, I think I will eat the first two chaos being corpses, for the power (although they should offer greater power than they currently do). I'm just concerned that without the removal of corruption from Yrruir, I will not have enough scrolls to take on Andor Drakon and deal with the increased corruption rate from being chaotic. I already had to use the four scrolls of chaos resistance from the dwarven mystic to remove my starting corruptions (which included the appearance and dexterity-abusing corrupted tissue corruption, and the mana battery corruption). Having Celestrix also apparently doubles the corruption rate (from the doomed intrinsic).

[Superteeth]

[QUOTE=Superteeth;85634]
I had been scumming the big room non-stop for the past two days in the hope of getting a ring of djinni summoning or amulet of life saving, but have had no luck (I have picked up many potions of stat raising, though).

Interestingly enough, after spending no more than 20 minutes in UC:5 (Tomb of the High Kings), I not only pickpocketed a Ring of Djinni Summoning, but I also killed something and it dropped an Amulet of Life Saving. Next step, a wand of wishing in the Tomb of the High Kings (which is where I found my first one, way back when when I did not even know about save scumming). There is no doubt in my mind that the RNG has something really nasty planned for me. Maybe I should just forget about fighting the Eternal Guardian....

Come to think of it, I think I have an idea of how this character will die. Seeing as how I had scummed the big room for 2 days, I have killed 16,000 monsters already. 34 Cave Lions, 46 Cave Tigers, and 16 Wild Cats are among these monsters. You see, I usually try to avoid killing cats, although I really hate them. But when they start pissing me off by following me everywhere and attacking when I am just trying to make my way along, I just can't control myself. So I kill them. After that, I just don't care anymore, and literally seek out cats to kill in horrendous ways (although I usually kick them to death). I can be running past enemies in, say, the Big Room to get to the stairs, but if I see a cat, I kill it. In fact, if I ever did manage to get the Ring of the Master Cat, I would equip it in my missile slot and chuck it at any cat I see, friendly or not, and kill them (and proceed to wear the ring again for the bonuses). I have a feeling I will come across the Cat Lord level and find that the Cat Lord is right next to the stairs down. The super Cat Lord, boosted with all the souls of the cats I had murdered, will then proceed to eat me for breakfast. Oh well.

[Carter]

These are my stats while "Strained!" and in "Normal" mode: DV=40, PV=35. I have a hefty eternium two-handed sword, and can switch to a crappy one-handed weapon plus a crystal tower shield. 30 Strength, 18 Learning, 24 Willpower, 33 Dexterity, 24 Toughness, 329 health, and nothing else is really relevant for a chaos knight. I have one corruption, very light, which hit my strength and toughness hard, but the speed (147) will help to run circles around the guardian (along with my blessed seven league boots). I could hit and run, or I could use my longbow with arrows of slaying (I have found no humanoid slayers). If I switch to chaotic before fighting the guardian, I will get the weapon skill randomizing skill, and will get 1d21 speed every turn in addition to the 147. For this reason, I do not think that the guardian will be the problem.).

I think you'll be surprised how hard he hits, and how many HP he has. Your current EQ is not enough to kill him in melee as he has ridiculous PV. You'd really need a sword of penetration. Your slaying arrows will work but you'd need a heap of them.