Not getting 2nd precrown...

[gr3ybird]

lv 13, have only generated 1 art afaik, have probably sacced at least 150 critters since first crown, maybe more like 200. Still at very close where I started. Prayers are not answered. Has something changed in r52?

[gr3ybird]

Got it. How in the world do people say "oh, precrowning is easy, I think I'll do 3x?" Is there some trick I'm missing?

Otherwise, I'm never doing this again.

[divij]

i think the very close part is due to a bug with precrowning....you are probably better than very close...as to why you are not getting your 2nd precrown, i had the same problem 1ce and didnt manage to get precrowned..also for the rest of the game i never went abv very close (though i did get crowned)...which is annoying. hence, i have decided till the bug is fixed, i am never getting precrowned again. it is too much of a hassle....better is to get crowned and then do a post crowning. that way you get an indication if you are veryclose, favors, favors greatly and absolutely close, when you can pray. OR it might be that you missed counting some artifacts!

[Dlightfull]

i think the very close part is due to a bug with precrowning....you are probably better than very close...as to why you are not getting your 2nd precrown, i had the same problem 1ce and didnt manage to get precrowned..also for the rest of the game i never went abv very close (though i did get crowned)...which is annoying. hence, i have decided till the bug is fixed, i am never getting precrowned again. it is too much of a hassle....better is to get crowned and then do a post crowning. that way you get an indication if you are veryclose, favors, favors greatly and absolutely close, when you can pray. OR it might be that you missed counting some artifacts!

As far as i know, the second precrown costs three times as much as the first, if not even more. I got a second precrown twice and in both games it worked as intended, went from very close to favors you then to favors you greatly and then to extremely close, that's when i got precrowned.

Crowning, however, costs just as much as a first precrown and if you get that first precrown, then crowning occurs at very close, yes.

As i understand it, there's no bug whatsoever, it's just a misunderstanding of messages.

[Blasphemous]

The rough average is that you need 3x the amount of sacrifice for second precrown.
I only precrown twice when the altar is on a cavernous level because then creature generation rate is sufficient to make it in reasonable time.
The "very close" message does change after some more sacrificing and follows the old pattern of very close -> favors ->favors greatly and finally extremely close (or absolutely for extreme alignment and crowning). Just keep sacrificing and it will eventually happen. 150 monsters is not enough.
Precrowning twice is easy but not always feasible. Circumstances and dungeon layout are decisive factors in this so it's not always a good idea.
Oh, when you're N, don't try a second precrown - you can't sac all living monsters that show up (no animals) and thus it takes much longer to pull it off.
I almost never precrown as N, because L is better in every way.

I never go for a post-crown - it severely restricts your choices.
When I crown, I don't have a chance for a post crown because at that point I have already generated too many artifacts.
Getting extreme alignment is time and effort consuming when forced, unless you let it go its own course - killing many chaotic creatures, clearing the tower of flames, saving Khelavaster, all of which come in the mid game and provide a large boost to lawful alignment. At that point crowning is both easier and more desirable.

This is for three reasons:
a) You can better control what immunity you get, so you won't double on fire or lightning.
b) With some artifacts generated randomly, you have a chance to eliminate some undesirables from the crowning pool of your class and have a higher chance of getting something you actually need.
Many classes have two or more artifacts that totally suck (or even more, like thieves).
c) You can swap alignment for mystic's scrolls or chaos trinity quests and return to the desired alignment when you need, while if you are crowned already, you can fall from grace and that is generally very undesirable.

[Drifted]

I've never went for 3 precrowns as far as I remember. I've grinded 2 precrowns few times in normal level layout but not bothering with that anymore. Only going for 2 if I happen to luck out an altar in cavernous level. Stuck on very close hasn't been a problem for me. I just take care I have everything fine and pray. If I'm not close enough for (pre)crown my prayers will remain unheard. I've understood it uses non existant amount of piety. I have never done postcrowning and Blasphemous sums up the same reasons I have. I tend to crown after visiting dwarven mystic for guaranteed ring of ice and chance for SoCC. At that point it's too late to go for pre/postcrowning.

[auricbond]

I've done three precrowns a few times out of pure greed, but it's never fun and I always question my decision once I get going. 1 precrowning is never too bad, 2 is very painful, 3 is "what the hell am I doing? This isn't even remotely fun". Especially concerning is when the piety decays in sudden jumps. No idea what triggers this but I've gotten to "favors" only for it to slip back to very close seconds of gameplay later, and it takes 8 or more sacs to get it back to favors. It's punishing, but I tend to press on due to the sunk cost fallacy.

One thing i've wondered at is how monster generation works. I've found myself having to leave the level, kill a few things and re-enter to kick up the monster generation again. However on the odd rare occasion I've gotten the level to a point where it can take 500 or more turns for a single monster to show up, despite not saccing especially much to my knowledge. No idea why this happens.

[anon123]

One thing i've wondered at is how monster generation works. I've found myself having to leave the level, kill a few things and re-enter to kick up the monster generation again. However on the odd rare occasion I've gotten the level to a point where it can take 500 or more turns for a single monster to show up, despite not saccing especially much to my knowledge. No idea why this happens.

There is a bug in the game causing monster generation on a level to stop, or at least slow down so much you wouldn't notice the difference. I have had it happen in the SMC and BVL, while hunting for beggar booze. It can be fixed by just leaving the level and returning, though.

[Blasphemous]

Yes, experience shows leaving and returning via staircase "resets" how the level generates monsters back to its initial status.
Done usually ~5 times for 1st precrown, depending on the level layout.
The best setup (not counting cavernous levels) is with centrally located altar, big rooms and extra connections dug with a wand of digging or a pickaxe, to streamline the flow of monsters toward the PC.
Sort of "all roads lead to Rome" method.

[auricbond]

There is a bug in the game causing monster generation on a level to stop, or at least slow down so much you wouldn't notice the difference. I have had it happen in the SMC and BVL, while hunting for beggar booze. It can be fixed by just leaving the level and returning, though.

No, this is different, it was permanent no matter how much time I spent off the level. I always thought the decline in monster generation you're talking about was intentional, to make shooting for precrownings more challenging.

Yes, experience shows leaving and returning via staircase "resets" how the level generates monsters back to its initial status.
Done usually ~5 times for 1st precrown, depending on the level layout.
The best setup (not counting cavernous levels) is with centrally located altar, big rooms and extra connections dug with a wand of digging or a pickaxe, to streamline the flow of monsters toward the PC.
Sort of "all roads lead to Rome" method.

Funny you should say that: the level where the monster spawns dried up permanently was on a level that I had spent a while digging out.