Improving two weapon combat

[AlterAsc]

Because at the moment two-weapon fighting (TWF) is weak. Let's make it decent at least. (Needle and Sting doesn't count for the purpose of discussion)

1H + shield is the safe choice and needs no explanation.
2H (weapons that correspond to two-handed skill) received buff somewhere in 1.2.0 and damage with them rose significantly. And if you take PV into consideration, damage is way better than for 1H + shield. But you lose your shield DV.
TWF: two weak attacks at the cost of 1.5 attacks (generalization) and no shield DV. Second problem is if one weapon is significantly better, then TWF is worse then only attacking with better weapon.

My suggestions on how to improve TWF:

• Introduce chance to additionally attack with one(or both) weapons depending on TWF skill with no added energy cost. Basically free attacks sometimes. Masters of two weapon combat can surely do better than swing one weapon then another? Cons: no idea how hard to implement.
• Off-hand weapons were commonly used for parrying and such IRL. Let's have additional DV bonus depending on weapon skill/dexterity/what ever if your offhand is dagger/sword class weapon. Cons: that's just boring.
• Add more damage when fighting with two weapons. That's even more boring, but duh.
• Limit of 60 stones for zero penalty from weight is kinda low. Maybe we should base it on Strength instead? With progression like: 10 St - 60, 20 St - 100, 30 St - 150. Or something. Rangers stilll get their class power for twice weight allowed/four times weight allowed.
• Quality of life improvement - if you finish the opponent with first strike, you use less energy compared to normal two-hit strike. Not sure if possible, but would be nice to have when fighting multiple enemies.

Or something. Thread needs your ideas.

[blunk]

Howabout a big warning sign?
I sort of like your last suggestion.
Ie not getting robbed of energy on one hit kills.
But I probably wouldnt use it anyway.

[auricbond]

Maybe gloves of carrying + an improved basher talent line could help...

[Blank4u47]

How about this, have the base energy cost be reduced by 100-200, then add the combined weights to the cost, so lighter weapons attack faster, and furthermore, Rangers get a real edge with their class powers.

For example, right now the cost is 800- 4(two weapon skill) + weapon energy cost. Instead we could have 600-4(two weapon fighting skill) + weapon weight+ weapon energy cost.

This would allow rangers of the appropriate level lvls attack faster with bigger weapons, and it would allow smaller weapons to attack faster (assassin dualing daggers come to mind)

[grobblewobble]

How about this, have the base energy cost be reduced by 100-200, then add the combined weights to the cost, so lighter weapons attack faster, and furthermore, Rangers get a real edge with their class powers.

For example, right now the cost is 800- 4(two weapon skill) + weapon energy cost. Instead we could have 600-4(two weapon fighting skill) + weapon weight+ weapon energy cost.

This would allow rangers of the appropriate level lvls attack faster with bigger weapons, and it would allow smaller weapons to attack faster (assassin dualing daggers come to mind)

Sounds very good to me. Elegant solution, which makes dual wielding worth it in specific circumstances without being OP.

[AlterAsc]

Inconsistent. Swinging dagger and an axe takes the same time, yet swinging two axes takes more time than swinging two daggers?
Already typical setup for TWF is two daggers (or two scimitars for that one character roleplay). Why further encourage the one combination that is already used most of the time? I think we need to make other combinations viable choice too.

[ghostjghost]

A good point - maybe weapon skill level can also decrease energy cost for weapon use. So if you are much more skilled with axes(or whatever) you can duel wield them better than duel wielding daggers(previous example) with 0 skill - am I making sense?

[AlterAsc]

It already works like that. Energy cost for TW attack is [800 - 4xTWF skill + greater attack cost of weapons that are wielded]

[Blank4u47]

Inconsistent. Swinging dagger and an axe takes the same time, yet swinging two axes takes more time than swinging two daggers?
Already typical setup for TWF is two daggers (or two scimitars for that one character roleplay). Why further encourage the one combination that is already used most of the time? I think we need to make other combinations viable choice too.

It would make a lot of sense that a full-on assault with two heavy weapons would take more time to recover from than two light weapons, hence a higher energy cost. It would also make light prefixes weapons more valuable.

[JellySlayer]

It would make a lot of sense that a full-on assault with two heavy weapons would take more time to recover from than two light weapons, hence a higher energy cost. It would also make light prefixes weapons more valuable.

It also, frankly, gives a practical benefit to some lighter weapons. In terms of one handers, the lightest weapons like daggers and shortswords, are generally outclassed by medium-to-heavy weight weapons, notably spears, but also flails, some maces, etc.

In any event, once you get into higher metal stuff, nothing is really that heavy anyway. Dual wielding flails sounds at least as crazy to me as dual-wielding whips, but eternium flails are light enough that it isn't too much of a problem.

Note to self: Play a character who dual wields for the entire game.