Still playing in 1.2.0 pre 23, looking for some advice

[magpie]

Up to the 'curtain of fire' ...

I haven't got a ring of ice yet, but I have got a lot of other good stuff - my rustproof phase dagger is proving to be very nice. And piles of slaying ammunition - my missile weapon skills aren't the best (5 for Bows and for Crossbows), but they should suffice for the few times I'll need them. I could go train them up a bit by shooting down gremlins, or something like that. So offence shouldn't be a problem.

I was crowned (about 75k and Big Punch was enough sacrificial fodder for it) with acid immunity and Trusted One - Trusted One isn't the best weapon, but it's nice to switch to versus certain enemies.

I'll probably hit the Tomb of the High Kings next - the cavernous levels are usually good for some drops.

I can see that I should be able to win this game if I don't do anything massively stupid, or if my computer doesn't BSOD mid-game or something. Bards are a struggle to get rolling, but once they get rolling ... wow, they are pretty powerful. The versatility they have is great.

[JellySlayer]

Bard crowning gifts are among the worst of any class, IMHO. Boots of divine messenger are decent, though Bards have guaranteed 7Lbs, so it's less of a perk than it might otherwise be. Nothing else there is really that exceptional. I guess Cloak of Oman is okay.

I've always wondered whether Trusted One would be worth using as an off-hand dual wield for the extra defensive characteristics. It's not quite as good as the best shields in terms of raw DV, but it has good PV and lots of nice intrinsics.

[Burb]

I've always wondered whether Trusted One would be worth using as an off-hand dual wield for the extra defensive characteristics. It's not quite as good as the best shields in terms of raw DV, but it has good PV and lots of nice intrinsics.

Hm, at first I just sort of assumed the energy cost would make it not worth it, but some more math shows that it could be viable.

Level 100 TWF makes it only a 400 energy penalty, but you can reduce attacking to an < 800 energy cost at weapon skill level 9 (fairly achievable benchmark). Trusted one would have to do > 1/3 your main weapon's damage to not be detrimental to your damage output (assuming swords is your lowest skill level, as twf takes the energy cost of the worse one). At skill level 9 swords get a +5 damage, so trusted one would do (5-15 + 5 = 15 damage on average) which is actually slightly greater than half the damage of a sword of sharpness (4 - 32 + 6 +5 = 29 damage on average). Not bad.

I'm not sure exactly how strength affects melee damage and how it would affect the offhand differently, but I would imagine flat bonuses would decrease the relative difference between the two weapons making them more and more equal. Although, the higher weapon skill level the higher the energy penalty is relatively, which also affects things. Lastly though I should point out trusted one has a relatively high weight for dual wielding at 60s, which sort of restricts your available options unless you're a ranger.

I'd lastly like to note though that stronger attacks that take more energy are (IMO) not as strategically useful as faster weaker attacks if the damage output is relatively equal. Against hordes of monsters, if you can kill them in a single blow the extra damage is wasted while you're expending more energy. For example, bad against weak monsters that you don't want to spend time being surrounded by, maybe because of speical attacks like ghosts or ghuls or because you simply want to clear a path to the summoner as soon as possible. It's also kind of bad against strong opponents where you want the fight to be as granular as possible so you can reevaluate the situation at every step as to whether you need to heal or retreat.

[Blank4u47]

Wielding trusted one and sos would weigh a total of 95s, so the penalty would only be -3 to hit from the weight alone, -2 from having twf skill at 100 (normally it's -6 but the skill adds 4) which actually isn't very detrimental at all.
Then take into account that if you put your weaker weapon in the main hand, you don't lose any damage comparably, and you always hit first with your main hand, so you end up getting free weapon skill training because you don't explode everything in The first hit, and you still also kill most things in 1 round too.

I guess what I'm saying is that there's a definite advantage to dual wielding, but it's more long term and you should switch up weapon/shield setup when facing something harder to deal with

[magpie]

Well, I grinded up to level 25 in the cavern above the TotHK ... no ring of ice, wish or Concentration ...but I did end up with a lot of demon slaying ammo, so I decided to simply do the Tower without a ring of ice. It ended up being easy - you know, the old magic mapping/teleport trick.

The Wyrm fell down very easily, although I did get death bolted once ... good thing I was crowned with Trusted One, so I could simply wield it for death resistance while I was wearing my red dragon scale mail! And thanks to getting some castings of Heal at level 18, I didn't even have to use any potions of extra healing! (GREAT class power )

I've decided not to even bother with the minotaur maze or the Ice Queen Domain ... my phase dagger is proving very handy, especially with two sets of seven league boots on hand. I think I'm just gonna finish now ... no need to fool around with un-necessary stuff. I've basically got everything I need now. The only thing that could mess with my chances now would be the good old Chaos Archmage, but even then, I already have what I need to deal with him, so ... basically, if I don't win this one, it will be my own fault. And since I've done most of the game with melee, I can count it as a melee win, can't I?

[auricbond]

The Wyrm fell down very easily, although I did get death bolted once ... good thing I was crowned with Trusted One, so I could simply wield it for death resistance while I was wearing my red dragon scale mail!

He has an energy ray, not a death ray.

[magpie]

Yeah, you're not wrong. But it still hurt like hell.

Well, up to Air Temple, which I will do after I sleep. It's pretty late here. Found Kinslayer in the gift shop, which will prove useful (my good weapon skills are Swords, at 11, and Daggers at 12).

Also managed to get the Ring of the Master Cat - although there's not much excuse not to get it on a Bard.

So, anything to be careful of from this point, apart for my own carelessness and, of course, Nuurag-Varn?

[blunk]

Yeah, you're not wrong. But it still hurt like hell.

Well, up to Air Temple, which I will do after I sleep. It's pretty late here. Found Kinslayer in the gift shop, which will prove useful (my good weapon skills are Swords, at 11, and Daggers at 12).

Also managed to get the Ring of the Master Cat - although there's not much excuse not to get it on a Bard.

So, anything to be careful of from this point, apart for my own carelessness and, of course, Nuurag-Varn?

Pet (if you use) turning from trap or target mistake.
Doppleganger kings (easy with wands), Wyrms, emp lich, greater titan quarrel can possibly one shot you.
Greater vault on D45-46 maybe.

Most stuff mentioned requires you to be somewhat careless.

[Tyrnyx]

I just want to say that I have used swords of sharpness all the way through the game twice. Fighter and druid. The Fighter used melee almost exclusively (I rarely train missiles as much as I should).

Obviously in your case Kinslayer is the better choice (although I haven't calculated anything, just love slaying) but SoS are, while not great, good enough. I guess I rely to heavily on the RNG.

Also, forgive me for not putting this in a spoiler box (don't know how) but:

doesn't a certain dwarf give a certain frosty every time to neutrals in versions >=20

[magpie]

Yes, but I was going for my first lawful win, so I wanted to go with that restriction for this game. It didn't matter, I eventually picked up a ring of ice - on D:50.

Managed a win! I'm pretty stoked, this is only my third win, and my first which was done mostly with melee.