Wanting to win! Advice needed.

[Shinae]

Usually I head there after dwarf town quests and after clearing the pyramid, around 17 or 18.

Way too early. I wouldn't step in ToEF that low level. You can succeed with right equipment and bit of luck, but even unlucky crit from Fire elemental can mean insta death. I always do Ice queen, griffiyard, Frost jarl caves, high kings and even dark forge before ToEF. Unless I know I have good equips, good hp pool and ways to defeat ACW. I get Water Orb too before tower, unless I have good stuff. That +10 Wi can be useful in tower.

[Soirana]

Hi guys,

I try to level up skills with ranged, but I just can't seem to put it all together.

and wizards are too tedious for me.

Well, if you want no missiles and no spells, play something like dwarf barb and at some point farm ~20 pots of booze (that is overkill, but it should cover you for the rest of game).

Way too early. I wouldn't step in ToEF that low level. You can succeed with right equipment and bit of luck, but even unlucky crit from Fire elemental can mean insta death.

Let's sort basics --
fire elementals are rather rare in first 3 floors and ones in temple should not be disturbed if assault is done properly. (check Steam guide if you need advice on that);
unless you are wearing something like crown of science crits typically produce saving throw leaving at least 1hp (need certain percentage of health prior to that, don't recall exact % right now).

Overall, getting unlucky at lv18 in frost giant caves is more likely than in ToEF (for melee char, casters I am not sure).
ToEF is not half bad as you try to picture - Kings ring, elemental gauntlets + intrinsic covers fire damage, mystic always gives ring of ice if you talk with him as neutral. As long as you do not camp in there and bring few blessed invisibility potions things should be just fine even without water orb - dwarven quests should produce enough healing potions and for Wyrm lure out and disable is priority anyway.

[zliplus]

When I went to ToEF at 21 with a DE BF, I had to run away from the wyrm because I couldn't do enough damage to him in melee, and come back with slaying ammunition. It should certainly be possible, but requires a lot of caution. Definitely grind to level 18 first though, why do anything as level 17 when that amazing class ability is so close?

[Soirana]

When I went to ToEF at 21 with a DE BF, I had to run away from the wyrm because I couldn't do enough damage to him in melee,

Offensive wand + couple blessed pots of booze, typically gets job done.

From my experience if melee is not cutting, the answer is almost always booze...

[Automater]

Ok, I've got a great de beast fighter going and an altar on SMC right next to the down staircase, I'm going to get pre crowned, boost my learning and do dwarf quests, pyramid, graveyard, get Rothk, then clear the random dungeons, do the ice queen quests, clear dark forge, obtain the water orb then hopefully be 25+ and attempt the toef using any wands I have, hopefully I can get some slaying ammo. Wish me luck & thx for the tips.

[Blasphemous]

I'd advice against precrowning in SMC - the first high level undead or golem will screw you big time as neither can be sacced and both are fairly common. Corpse fiends past lvl 10-15 are deadly for such chars, as are stone statues.

[SinsI]

I'd advice against precrowning in SMC - the first high level undead or golem will screw you big time as neither can be sacced and both are fairly common. Corpse fiends past lvl 10-15 are deadly for such chars, as are stone statues.

He can get piety while low level and lvl up to 8/11 afterward.

[Tyrnyx]

I prefer Melee.

Me too. And I've won with every class except for assassins (I'm trying to do an ultra on them). For my advice:

1. Run away when things are hard. Don't take on mixed tension rooms or vaults until your several levels higher than you would take on a normal room. You DONT have to clear a whole room if you open it. They can kill you, just avoid them. If you get them just run to the stairs. Risk reward is something you get a feel for the more you play.
2. If you are fortunate enough to get an early wish (I like to clear out pools in the HMV if my character is only midling in strength, if they're doing very well then avoid pools typically) I would suggest either rings! of regeneration (especially if you don't have healing) or red dragon scale mails. I would suggest not getting an AoLS - especially with the reduction on the rate of corruptions, Khelly's gifts are only midling for a non-spell caster.
3. Even if you prefer melee, some levels in missile skills is incredibly helpful. Somewhere in the mid-game take your biggest stack of arrows and/or bolts and fire them all in the big room. Save slaying ammo. Then use that ammo when your in a tight situation. Particularly useful is just plain slaying ammo or humanoid.
4. Raven birthsign is amazing. +10 speed is strong and getting the trident at 16 is silly powerful. It can easily be gotten if you have a blessed ring of the fish (or helm or amulet of water breathing), and either (a) invisibility or (b) teleport control and the guaranteed wand of teleport. I've done it without water breathing but that's a dicey proposition and I would not suggest it. The trident makes a really strong missile so I suggest it even for beastfighters.
5. Get crowned. It's often a great way to buff your PV/DV or your damage. Dwarves and Hurthlings have easier crownings since they get full value at Waldy and they can sell accumulated crap to get large mounds of money. Hurthlings also can cook corpses and sac them for good value. Other easy methods of crowning include: having an alter on a cavernous level (or up or downstairs is doable provided the alter is close enough). Places to look: above/below the big room. Vault levels (always explore these for opening a vault). Puppy cave (level 10+). Putrid caves (level 15+). TotHK (level 18+).
6. That said: play a class with good crowning gifts. I also prefer a class-race combo that can get 25 in toughness by default - dwarves or orcs. Munching on cursed morgia roots (the top and bottom row herbs of any level) to up your To is great.
7. Know when to pray. Don't forget about it but never rely on it. After praying sac that worthless pile of gold you've been hauling around with you. It serves no other purpose. (I never look through the casino)
8. Don't kick down every locked door. Explore as much as you can before kicking down a locked door. If you know there is a trap there, try not to kick down that door at all.
9. The puppy is a usually a trap. So is finding the raider lord. Do them at your own risk.
10. I try to only do the dwarven halls when I have teleport control and a wand of teleport.

Have fun.

[Blasphemous]

He can get piety while low level and lvl up to 8/11 afterward.

While piety decay will take him all the way down to "very close".
Also, even at low level, there are undead and there are summons, neither of which can be sacced.
SMC altar is good for immediate needs like item status check or holy water blessing but not for precrown or crown and that is from personal experience.
PC or VD/DD are much better.

[Automater]

WOW.

DE beastfighter candleborn, altar on SMC right next to downcase, another altar on UD7, PILES (100+ pepperpetals) of herbs, 30/18 dv/pv, tactics obtained, 100 alert/athl/dodge/herb/healing 21/22 strength/To 17 Le 26 Dx 23 perception, precrowned with TRUE AIM, i've got 7 arrows of dragon slaying, lvl 8 bows lvl 9 unarmed, exp lvl 15 getting rdy for pyramid, rolling great, motivated, trying to win for the love of god. what more could you ask for? was clearing random dungeon, i think R3. Bottom lvl meets a Horrible Dorn Beast, 1 hit paralyzed, -9.

I swear I'm never going to beat this game.

10 f*cking years.