Nomic 1.0

[Kyreles]

This is a game of Nomic and the starting rules are as follows:

§001: Any player may set forth a motion to take some official action. Official actions include, but are not limited to, amendment of or additions of rules.

§002: All official motions must be in bold and italics and begin with "I make a motion to..." Additionally, official motions must end with "For the purposes of voting, this motion shall be referred to as [username]'s motion to...", followed by a summary of the motion's actions, with "[username]" replaced by the motion-maker's username. For example, one could say "I make a motion to promote Kyreles to the cerimonial position of The Creator of the Nomic. For the purposes of voting, this motion shall be referred to as Kyreles's motion to grant himself a meaningless title."

§:003 To vote in favor of or against a motion, one must declare one's vote by saying "I cast my vote [in favor of/against] [motion-maker]'s motion to [motion summary]." For example, one could say "I cast my vote in favor of Kyreles's motion to grant himself a meaningless title.".

§004: If at any point there are three votes from three different players in favor of a motion, the motion passes and is acted upon. If at any point there are three votes from three different players against a motion, the motion fails. If the motion passes, and requires that the rules be amended, the motion-maker must do this as soon as possible, and post the revised ruleset. If the motion-maker fails to do this within 48 hours of the motion's passage, the motion's state is changed, and it fails.






The State of the Nomic

Rules:

§001: Any player may set forth a motion to take some official action. Official actions include, but are not limited to, amendment of or additions of rules.

§002: Motions can be written in bold and / or italics for clarity, if you like or you can write them in an abbreviated form:
"[motion summary] motion: [description]."
Example: "Meaningless Title motion: Kyreless will be granted the meaningless title of The Creator of the Nomic." There is no set format for motions to be submitted.

§003 Votes can be written in bold and / or italics for clarity, if you like. To vote in favor of or against a motion, one must declare one's vote.

§004: If at any point there are three votes from three different players in favor of a motion, the motion passes and is acted upon. If at any point there are three votes from three different players against a motion, the motion fails. If the motion passes, and requires that the rules be amended, the motion-maker must do this as soon as possible, and post the revised ruleset. If the motion-maker fails to do this within 48 hours of the motion's passage, the motion's state is changed, and it fails.

§005 Every player has the option to veto a motion once all by himself. After posting his veto the player must create a random character. If he manages to win the game and proves so by posting the .flg in the YAVP-forum, the motion is vetoed. If he fails, his veto fails. If the motion is passed by acquiring 3 approving votes before the game is ended, the motion is successful and the game is of no further influence on the motion.

§006 All participants in this game of Nomic have to make a choice. Either they join the pro-treasure hunter camp, or they have to join the anti-treasure hunter camp. Those who join the pro-treasure hunter camp have to edit their signature, adding a line that expresses their enthusiasm about treasure hunter. It doesn't matter what exactly you say, as long as it is clear to all that you would never give up on Treasure Hunter because it is the most awesome talent ever. Be creative! Those who join the anti-treasure camp also have to edit their signature, adding a line to express their disgust about the most miserable talent in ADOM, treasure hunter.

§007 Each player may only propose one new motion at a time, and they can only do so if they don't already have any previous motions up for voting.

§008 All Players are 'allowed to taunt grey in this thread'.

§009 In order to introduce a motion you must have voted on all outstanding motions

§010 If a motion is passed or cancelled while a player is attempting to veto it, the player may attempt to veto a different motion using the same game character.

§011 We create an ACCOUNT with username 'nomic'. It will have a public pass, so we can all edit the original post. We take all this mess we have so far, stick t in an initial post, then edit it as if it were a wiki.

§012 Players shall not be allowed to vote on their own motions. Also they shall be allowed to withdraw a motion they submitted by declaring they wish to do so. Furthermore, no player shall be allowed to vote more than once on each motion


Open Issues:

Restricted-actions-motion (1 for, 2 against) Joe
IT ARE PROOF motion (2 for, 2 against) grobblewobble
stellian's motion of guilt and shame (1 for, 2 against) stellian
Kyreles' motion to insert a plot (0 for, 0 against) Kyreles


If there are mistakes let me know and I'll fix it.

[Kyreles]

I make a motion to require that the third motion in this game of Nomic involve ninjas.

[_Ln_]

I make a motion to require that the third motion in this game of Nomic involve ninjas.

After reading Wiki I thought you were supposed to abide the rules and you just broke #2! Shame on you!

[Kyreles]

After reading Wiki I thought you were supposed to abide the rules and you just broke #2! Shame on you!

f.

I make a motion to introduce points into the game. A player shall be awarded two (2) points for each motion that player sets forth that is accepted into the rules. A player shall be fined one (1) point for each infraction of the rules. For the purposes of voting, this motion shall be referred to as Kyreles's motion to introduce points.

[gut]

... so, nomic gives one all the work and long-windedness of bureaucracy, but none of the money?

[Kyreles]

There can be currency system if it's voted into place. Then there can be gambling, duels, chess, adom challanges, demands to receive a postcard or whatever. Points can be money.

[gut]

I make a motion that kyreles puts money into my paypal account
for every post I make in this thread. The amount of money shall
be in proportion to the time I spend typing said post. The amount of
money shall not excede the amount needed to buy a Russian bride, yet
not be below the amount required to purchase an energy drink available
from my local grocer. For the purposes of voting, this motion shall be
referred to as 'a poor politician is a poor politician' rule.

[grobblewobble]

Cool idea. To be honest I doubt there is enough interest for Nomic, but I'll play along.

I don't really like the proposed point system, because when a motion you made passes this is already a succes and doesn't need an additional reward.

I cast my vote against Kyreles's motion to introduce points.

I make a motion to reduce text clutter. When making a motion or voting, italic and bold text styles will become optional, rather than obligatory. In addition, it will be allowed to do it in the following abbreviated forms:
Motions:
"[motion name] motion: [description]." For example: "Meaningless Title motion: Kyreless will be granted the meaningless title of FooBar."
Voting:
"I vote [for / against] [username's] [motion name] motion." For example: I vote for Kyreles's Meaningless Title motion.

For the purposes of voting, this motion shall be referred to as grobblewobble's motion for simplified motions.

[_Ln_]

I cast my vote against Kyreles's motion to introduce points.
I cast my vote against gut's 'a poor politician is a poor politician' motion.
I cast my vote in favor of grobblewobble's motion for simplified motions

[Kyreles]

I cast my vote against gut's 'a poor politician is a poor politician' motion.(now 0 for, 2 against)
I cast my vote in favor of grobblewobble's motion for simplified motions(now 2 for, 0 against)
also 2 against Kyreles' motion to introduce points

[Joe]

I cast my vote against gut's 'a poor politician is a poor politician' motion
I cast my vote in favor of grobblewobble's motion for simplified motions
I cast my vote against Kyreles's motion to introduce points.

Now that's done: 2 fired and one accepted and less clutter ftw!

Motion: AVV-motion (Adom Victory Veto). This gives every player the option to veto a motion once all by himself. After posting his veto the player must create a random character. If he manages to win the game and proves so by posting the .flg in the YAVP-forum the motion is vetoed. If he fails, his veto fails. If the motion is passed by acquiring 3 approving votes before the game is ended, the motion is successful and the game is of no further influence on the motion.

[grobblewobble]

The new rules:

§001: Any player may set forth a motion to take some official action. Official actions include, but are not limited to, amendment of or additions of rules.

§002: Motions can be written in bold and / or italics for clarity, if you like.
You can write them in the old form:
"I make a motion to..." [description of motion] "For the purposes of voting, this motion shall be referred to as [username]'s motion to [motion summary]"
Example: "I make a motion to promote Kyreles to the cerimonial position of The Creator of the Nomic. For the purposes of voting, this motion shall be referred to as Kyreles's motion to grant himself a meaningless title."
Or you can write them in an abbreviated form:
"[motion summary] motion: [description]."
Example: "Meaningless Title motion: Kyreless will be granted the meaningless title of The Creator of the Nomic."

§003 Votes can be written in bold and / or italics for clarity, if you like.
To vote in favor of or against a motion, one must declare one's vote. This can be done in the old form, by saying
"I cast my vote [in favor of / against] [motion-maker]'s motion to [motion summary]."
Example: "I cast my vote in favor of Kyreles's motion to grant himself a meaningless title."
Or the new form can be used:
"I vote [for / against] [motion-maker]'s [motion summary] motion."
Example: "I vote for Kyreles's meaningless title motion."

§004: If at any point there are three votes from three different players in favor of a motion, the motion passes and is acted upon. If at any point there are three votes from three different players against a motion, the motion fails. If the motion passes, and requires that the rules be amended, the motion-maker must do this as soon as possible, and post the revised ruleset. If the motion-maker fails to do this within 48 hours of the motion's passage, the motion's state is changed, and it fails.

[grobblewobble]

Strictly speaking your motion doesn't follow the abbreviated form I defined, Joe.
I don't care, as the point was to allow more freedom in writing motions, so I will vote anyway. You could edit, or we could decide to add a line to the motion rules saying "screw all this, as long as it's clear what you mean it's cool." :p

I vote for Joe's AVV-motion.

Doomsday motion: all participants in this game of Nomic have to make a choice. Either they join the pro-treasure hunter camp, or they have to join the anti-treasure hunter camp. Those who join the pro-treasure hunter camp have to edit their signature, adding a line that expresses their enthusiasm about treasure hunter. It doesn't matter what exactly you say, as long as it is clear to all that you would never give up on Treasure Hunter because it is the most awesome talent ever. Be creative!
Those who join the anti-treasure camp also have to edit their signature, adding a line to express their disgust about the most miserable talent in ADOM, treasure hunter.

[Kyreles]

I vote in favor of Joe's AVV motion.
I vote in favor of grobblewobble's doomsday motion

gut's 'a poor politician is a poor politician' motion defeated.
Kyreles's motion to introduce points defeated.
grobblewobble's motion for simplified motions passed and integrated into rules below.


Rules:
§001: Any player may set forth a motion to take some official action. Official actions include, but are not limited to, amendment of or additions of rules.

§002: Motions can be written in bold and / or italics for clarity, if you like or you can write them in an abbreviated form:
"[motion summary] motion: [description]."
Example: "Meaningless Title motion: Kyreless will be granted the meaningless title of The Creator of the Nomic." There is no set format for motions to be submitted.

§003 Votes can be written in bold and / or italics for clarity, if you like. To vote in favor of or against a motion, one must declare one's vote.

§004: If at any point there are three votes from three different players in favor of a motion, the motion passes and is acted upon. If at any point there are three votes from three different players against a motion, the motion fails. If the motion passes, and requires that the rules be amended, the motion-maker must do this as soon as possible, and post the revised ruleset. If the motion-maker fails to do this within 48 hours of the motion's passage, the motion's state is changed, and it fails.


Open issues:
Joe's AVV-motion (2 for, 0 against)
Doomsday motion(1 for, 0 against)

I make a motion that in order to introduce a motion you must have voted on all outstanding motions. For the purposes of voting this may be refered to as Kyreles' motion to compel voting.

[gut]

ninjas = nay
Kyreles's motion to introduce points = nay
a poor politician is a poor politician = nay
grobblewobble's motion for simplified motions = nay #if anything, one should have to submit proposals in triplicate
Adom Victory Veto = nay #also, it is already becoming difficult to scan for motion names >:[
Kyreles' motion to compel voting = nay #the notion of 'outstanding motions' is flawed from the outset, as they are only valid as 'outstanding' if they have not yet been considered by a whopping 3 players. That is not my definition of 'outstanding' in any way :)



motion bureaucracy_should_be_as_complex_and_cumbersome_as _possible(syntax_of_player_proposal):
if syntax_of_player_proposal != 'python syntax':
return 'invalid proposal'
if syntax_of_player_proposal != 'some other equally complex and cumbersome syntax':
return 'invalid proposal'

motion grey_is_a_goof(successful_proposal, unsuccessful_proposal):
if successful_proposal == True:
return 'allowed to taunt grey in this thread'
if unsuccessful_proposal == True:
return 'still allowed to taunt grey in this thread'
else:
return 'still allowed to taunt grey in this thread

motion ammend_tard_rule('004: If at any point there are three votes from three different players'):
vote_method1 = '3 votes cast'
vote_method2 = '48 hours have passed'
if vote_method1 == True:
return 'perhaps 100 voters out of 103 didn't get to vote'
if vote_method2 == True:
return 'everyone gets a chance to vote'

[grobblewobble]

a poor politician is a poor politician = nay

It's funny no one voted on any of his own motions before. Are you sure about that motion, Kyreles? It means we will no longer be able to ignore any proposal from Gut..

[gut]

motion ignore_non_useful_posts(post_from_gut):
non_useful = 'trolling'
if post_from_gut == non_useful:
return 'place gut on ignore list'

[grobblewobble]

I vote against gut's ignore_non_useful_posts(post_from_gut) motion!

The let's-divide-the-forum-worse-than-is-even-possible-with-TH motion: All participants in Nomic have to choose, either join Camp gut or join Camp Grey. Two exception to this rule, of course. If your username is Grey, you automatically belong to Camp gut. If your username is gut, you automatically belong to Camp Grey.

[gut]

that was a good one :D

[stellian]

Vote for Joe's AVV-motion? (2/3 for, 1/3 against) [Y/n] y
Vote for bureaucracy_should_be_as_complex_and_cumbersome_as _possible? (0/3 for, 0/3 against) [Y/n] y (I'm looking forward to the first proposals written in Brainfuck)
Vote for ammend_tard_rule? (0/3 for, 0/3 against) [Y/n] n (I'm not even sure I get it...)
Vote for The let's-divide-the-forum-worse-than-is-even-possible-with-TH motion? (0/3 for, 0/3 against) [Y/n] y
Vote for Doomsday motion? (1/3 for, 0/3 against) [Y/n] Y!!! this should spark some totally new and never seen before discussion about Treasure Hunter! :rolleyes:
Vote for ignore_non_useful_posts? (0/3 for, 1/3 against) [Y/n] n
Vote for Kyreles' motion to compel voting? (0/3 for, 1/3 against) [Y/n] Y

So yay, Joe's AVV-motion has passed.

stellian's motion of suffrage facilitation: Each player may only have one motion active at any given time.

Updated motions (not sure about the rest):
bureaucracy_should_be_as_complex_and_cumbersome_as _possible? (1/3 for, 0/3 against)
ammend_tard_rule? (0/3 for, 1/3 against)
The let's-divide-the-forum-worse-than-is-even-possible-with-TH motion (1/3 for, 0/3 against)
Doomsday motion? (2/3 for, 0/3 against)
ignore_non_useful_posts? (0/3 for, 2/3 against)
Kyreles' motion to compel voting? (1/3 for, 1/3 against)

[Joe]

The new rules:


Rules:
§001: Any player may set forth a motion to take some official action. Official actions include, but are not limited to, amendment of or additions of rules.

§002: Motions can be written in bold and / or italics for clarity, if you like or you can write them in an abbreviated form:
"[motion summary] motion: [description]."
Example: "Meaningless Title motion: Kyreless will be granted the meaningless title of The Creator of the Nomic." There is no set format for motions to be submitted.

§003 Votes can be written in bold and / or italics for clarity, if you like. To vote in favor of or against a motion, one must declare one's vote.

§004: If at any point there are three votes from three different players in favor of a motion, the motion passes and is acted upon. If at any point there are three votes from three different players against a motion, the motion fails. If the motion passes, and requires that the rules be amended, the motion-maker must do this as soon as possible, and post the revised ruleset. If the motion-maker fails to do this within 48 hours of the motion's passage, the motion's state is changed, and it fails.

§005: Any player can try to veto a motion once all by himself. After posting his veto the player must create a random character. If he manages to win the game and proves so by posting the .flg in the YAVP-forum the motion is vetoed. If he fails, his veto fails. If the motion is passed by acquiring 3 approving votes before the game is ended, the motion is successful and the game is of no further influence on the motion.

Weird, paragraphs are messing up. Can't get it to show properly no matter what I try :s

[gut]

we have to find a way of including more per370#tage symbols in this

[grobblewobble]

Joe: did you try editing with the "go advanced" option?

I'm behind on voting, let's see..


motion bureaucracy_should_be_as_complex_and_cumbersome_as _possible(syntax_of_player_proposal):
if syntax_of_player_proposal != 'python syntax':
return 'invalid proposal'
if syntax_of_player_proposal != 'some other equally complex and cumbersome syntax':
return 'invalid proposal'

Hmm.. this rule will make all proposals invalid.. All proposals that aren't written in Python are invalidated by the first if statement and all proposals that are written in Python are invalidated by the second. Very sneaky way to end the game with a deadlock.. but I don't want the game to end yet.
I vote against gut's bureaucracy_should_be_as_complex_and_cumbersome_as _possible motion.



motion grey_is_a_goof(successful_proposal, unsuccessful_proposal):
if successful_proposal == True:
return 'allowed to taunt grey in this thread'
if unsuccessful_proposal == True:
return 'still allowed to taunt grey in this thread'
else:
return 'still allowed to taunt grey in this thread

I am a great fan of Grey, so I want to join camp Gut in the future because it's the camp he will be in. And as a loyal member of camp Gut, I have no choice but to
vote in favour of gut's grey_is_a_goof motion



motion ammend_tard_rule('004: If at any point there are three votes from three different players'):
vote_method1 = '3 votes cast'
vote_method2 = '48 hours have passed'
if vote_method1 == True:
return 'perhaps 100 voters out of 103 didn't get to vote'
if vote_method2 == True:
return 'everyone gets a chance to vote'

This rule is so unreadable, confusing and ambiguous that it has to pass.
I vote in favour of gut's ammend_tard_rule motion.


I make a motion that in order to introduce a motion you must have voted on all outstanding motions. For the purposes of voting this may be refered to as Kyreles' motion to compel voting.

I vote in favour of Kyreles' motion to compel voting.


stellian's motion of suffrage facilitation: Each player may only have one motion active at any given time.
What happens to the motions of players who have more than one motion active at the moment this motion passes?

Updated motions:


bureaucracy_should_be_as_complex_and_cumbersome_as _possible? (1/3 for, 1/3 against)
ammend_tard_rule? (1/3 for, 1/3 against)
The let's-divide-the-forum-worse-than-is-even-possible-with-TH motion (1/3 for, 0/3 against)
Doomsday motion? (2/3 for, 0/3 against)
grey_is_a_goof? (1/3 for, 0/3 against)
ignore_non_useful_posts? (0/3 for, 2/3 against)
Kyreles' motion to compel voting? (2/3 for, 1/3 against)
stellian's motion of suffrage facilitation? (0/3 for, 0/3 against)

[gut]

this is quickly becoming my favorite thread :D

[Kyreles]

I vote against the ignore_non_useful_posts motion (0 for, 3 against) defeated
I vote against the bureaucracy_should_be_as_complex_and_cumbersome_as _possible motion (0-2)
I vote in favor of the grey_is_a_goof motion (2-1)
I vote against the ammend_tard_rule (1-2)
I vote in favor of the let's-divide-the-forum-worse-than-is-even-possible-with-TH motion (2-0)
I vote in favor of Stellian's motion of suffrage facilitation (1-0)

I move that the text of rule 4 be change to remove the following passage: "If the motion passes, and requires that the rules be amended, the motion-maker must do this as soon as possible, and post the revised ruleset. If the motion-maker fails to do this within 48 hours of the motion's passage, the motion's state is changed, and it fails." For voting this may be refered to as "Kyreles' motion to make Nomic a little easier."

[Kyreles]

The State of the Nomic


Rules:
§001: Any player may set forth a motion to take some official action. Official actions include, but are not limited to, amendment of or additions of rules.

§002: Motions can be written in bold and / or italics for clarity, if you like or you can write them in an abbreviated form:
"[motion summary] motion: [description]."
Example: "Meaningless Title motion: Kyreless will be granted the meaningless title of The Creator of the Nomic." There is no set format for motions to be submitted.

§003 Votes can be written in bold and / or italics for clarity, if you like. To vote in favor of or against a motion, one must declare one's vote.

§004: If at any point there are three votes from three different players in favor of a motion, the motion passes and is acted upon. If at any point there are three votes from three different players against a motion, the motion fails. If the motion passes, and requires that the rules be amended, the motion-maker must do this as soon as possible, and post the revised ruleset. If the motion-maker fails to do this within 48 hours of the motion's passage, the motion's state is changed, and it fails.

§005 Every player the option to veto a motion once all by himself. After posting his veto the player must create a random character. If he manages to win the game and proves so by posting the .flg in the YAVP-forum, the motion is vetoed. If he fails, his veto fails. If the motion is passed by acquiring 3 approving votes before the game is ended, the motion is successful and the game is of no further influence on the motion.


Open issues:
Doomsday Motion (2 for, 0 against) grobblewobble
bureaucracy_should_be_as_complex_and_cumbersome_as _possible (1 for, 2 against) gut
grey_is_a_goof (2 for, 1 against) gut
ammend_tard_rule (1 for, 2 against) gut
The let's-divide-the-forum-worse-than-is-even-possible-with-TH motion (2 for, 0 against) grobblewobble
Stellian's motion of suffrage facilitation (1 for, 0 against) Stellian
Kyreles' motion to make Nomic a little easier (0 for, 0 against) Kyreles

[stellian]

stellian's motion of suffrage facilitation: Each player may only have one motion active at any given time.
What happens to the motions of players who have more than one motion active at the moment this motion passes?
May I amend my motion?


stellian's motion of suffrage facilitation: Each player may only propose one new motion at a time, and they can only do so if they don't already have any previous motions up for voting.

[_Ln_]

Doomsday Motion (2 for, 0 against) grobblewobble - voting for, so it's on now.
bureaucracy_should_be_as_complex_and_cumbersome_as _possible (1 for, 2 against) gut - voting against, so it's off now.
grey_is_a_goof (2 for, 1 against) gut - voting against.
ammend_tard_rule (1 for, 2 against) gut - voting against, so it's off now.
The let's-divide-the-forum-worse-than-is-even-possible-with-TH motion (2 for, 0 against) grobblewobble - voting against.
Stellian's motion of suffrage facilitation (1 for, 0 against) Stellian - voting for.
Kyreles' motion to make Nomic a little easier (0 for, 0 against) Kyreles - voting against.

Sorry, a bit lazy/busy to update rules.

[grobblewobble]

Doomsday Motion (2 for, 0 against) grobblewobble - voting for, so it's on now.

I guess I'll have to choose a side then. I think I'm pro.. no anti.. no pro TH! No, anti!

[JellySlayer]

Just for fun, I will attempt to veto Kyreles' motion to make Nomic a little easier.

My character is a Raven born troll farmer. Piece of cake :p

[edit]Nevermind. Dead.



------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Screenshot
------------------------------------------------------------------------------



^^^^^
^^@.^
^..^^
.^^















Veto St:27 Le: 6 Wi:10 Dx: 9 To:24 Ch: 6 Ap: 6 Ma: 8 Pe:13 C
DV/PV: 9/5 H: 30(30) P: 2(2) Exp: 1/0 DrCh Sp: 110

------------------------------------------------------------------------------


----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Character Information
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Veto St:27 Le: 6 Wi:10 Dx: 9 To:24 Ch: 6 Ap: 6 Ma: 8 Pe:13 C
DV/PV: 9/5 H: 30(30) P: 2(2) Exp: 1/0 M: 0



----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Background Information
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Name: Veto Race: male Troll Class: Farmer
Eye color: light blue Hair color: brown Complexion: ruddy
Height: 8'10" Weight: 509 pounds
Age: 17 (grown-up)
Star sign: Raven Birthday: 8/Raven (day 8 of the year)

YOUR HISTORY:
Your parents belong to the middle class. They are average people
living in average quarters. Your father is a craftsman of mediocre talent.
As a child you lived through happy days. Your parents tried to ease
your life as much as possible and gave you a lot of comfort.
In your youth you enjoyed competition against others to the
fullest. You were a very active kid.
As a young adult you were a credit to your family. Your parents
supported your plans and were very understanding. They tried to help you
along your way with all means at their disposal.
You decided to become a Farmer.


----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Weapon Skills
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Melee weapon Lvl Hit Dam DV Level Required marks
--------------------- --- --- --- -- ------------- --------------
Unarmed fighting 0 +0 +0 +0 unskilled 15
Daggers & knives 0 +0 +0 +0 unskilled 15
Clubs & hammers 0 +0 +0 +0 unskilled 15
Maces & flails 0 +0 +0 +0 unskilled 15
Swords 0 +0 +0 +0 unskilled 15
Axes 0 +0 +0 +0 unskilled 15
Whips 0 +0 +0 +0 unskilled 15
Pole arms 0 +0 +0 +0 unskilled 12
Twohanded weapons 2 +2 +2 +0 basic 40
Staves 0 +0 +0 +0 unskilled 15

Missile weapon Lvl Hit Dam Ra Level Required marks
--------------------- --- --- --- -- ------------- --------------
Slings 0 +0 +0 +0 unskilled 7
Bows 0 +0 +0 +0 unskilled 7
Crossbows 0 +0 +0 +0 unskilled 7
Thrown axes & hammers 0 +0 +0 +0 unskilled 7
Thrown daggers 0 +0 +0 +0 unskilled 7
Thrown rocks & clubs 0 +0 +0 +0 unskilled 7
Thrown spears 0 +0 +0 +0 unskilled 7
Boomerangs & scurgari 0 +0 +0 +0 unskilled 7

Shields Lvl DV Level Required marks
--------------------- --- --- ------------- --------------
Shields 0 +0 unskilled 15


Damage caused with your melee weapons:
--------------------------------------
ÆRight hand: Î+13Æ bonus to hit, Î1d10+11Æ damage


Damage caused with your missile weapons:
----------------------------------------
No missile weapons available.






----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Skills
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Archery .................. 16 (mediocre) [+3d4]
Athletics ................ 22 (mediocre) [+3d5]
Bridge building .......... 17 (mediocre) [+3d5] (mr)
Climbing ................. 31 (fair) [+3d4]
Cooking .................. 16 (mediocre) [+4d5] (ma)
First aid ................ 28 (mediocre) [+3d5]
Fletchery ................ 14 (mediocre) [+3d4] (ma)
Food preservation ........ 84 (great) [+3d3]
Gardening ................ 20 (mediocre) [+4d5]
Gemology ................. 14 (mediocre) [+2d4]
Haggling ................. 41 (fair) [+3d3]
Herbalism ................ 31 (fair) [+3d4]
Listening ................ 26 (mediocre) [+3d4]
Mining ................... 18 (mediocre) [+4d5]
Smithing ................. 11 (mediocre) [+3d5]
Stealth .................. 14 (mediocre) [+3d4]
Survival ................. 40 (fair) [+3d4]
Woodcraft ................ 13 (mediocre) [+4d5]




----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Inventory
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Total weight: 1720 stones Carrying capacity: 3975 stones

Head : hood [+0, +1] [3s]
Neck : -
Body : light furs [+0, +1] [180s]
Girdle : -
Cloak : -
Right Hand : heavy club (+4, 1d10+2) [-1, +0] [120s]
Left Hand : -
Right Ring : -
Left Ring : -
Bracers : -
Gauntlets : -
Boots : -
Missile weapon: -
Missiles : -
Tool : -


----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Stuff
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Total weight: 1417 stones Carrying capacity: 3975 stones

Tools (']')
fletchery set (5) [70s]
cooking set [100s]
Food ('%')
heap of 2 iron rations [200s]
piece of raw meat [20s]
heap of 3 herb seeds [6s]
heap of 10 plant seeds [20s]
heap of 5 large rations [1000s]
Valuables ('$')
111 gold pieces [1s]


----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Killed Monsters
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

He did not manage to vanquish any monsters.



----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Achievements
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

He survived for 0 years, 0 days, 0 hours, 0 minutes and 0 seconds (0 turns).
Veto visited 1 place.
His perception score was modified by +1 during his career.

[grobblewobble]

Need to post the new rules, or the Doomsday motion will be cancelled.


Rules:
§001: Any player may set forth a motion to take some official action. Official actions include, but are not limited to,
amendment of or additions of rules.

§002: Motions can be written in bold and / or italics for clarity, if you like. There is no set format for motions to be submitted.

§003 Votes can be written in bold and / or italics for clarity, if you like. To vote in favor of or against a motion, one must declare one's vote.

§004: If at any point there are three votes from three different players in favor of a motion, the motion passes and is acted upon.
If at any point there are three votes from three different players against a motion, the motion fails. If the motion passes, and
requires that the rules be amended, the motion-maker must do this as soon as possible, and post the revised ruleset. If the
motion-maker fails to do this within 48 hours of the motion's passage, the motion's state is changed, and it fails.

§005 Every player has the option to veto a motion once all by himself. After posting his veto the player must create a random character. If
he manages to win the game and proves so by posting the .flg in the YAVP-forum, the motion is vetoed. If he fails, his veto fails. If the
motion is passed by acquiring 3 approving votes before the game is ended, the motion is successful and the game is of no further influence
on the motion.

§006 All participants in this game of Nomic have to make a choice. Either they join the pro-treasure hunter camp, or they have to
join the anti-treasure hunter camp. Those who join the pro-treasure hunter camp have to edit their signature, adding a line that
expresses their enthusiasm about treasure hunter. It doesn't matter what exactly you say, as long as it is clear to all that you would
never give up on Treasure Hunter because it is the most awesome talent ever. Be creative!
Those who join the anti-treasure camp also have to edit their signature, adding a line to express their disgust about the most miserable
talent in ADOM, treasure hunter.

[Kyreles]

Today 02:56 PM
Just for fun, I will attempt to veto Kyreles' motion to make Nomic a little easier.

[edit]Nevermind. Dead.

Last edited by JellySlayer; Today at 03:02 PM.

He lasted 6 minutes? Nice.



Attempting to veto the bureaucracy_should_be_as_complex_and_cumbersome_as _possible motion Sword born High Elf Druid. Oh geez...


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Screenshot
------------------------------------------------------------------------------



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#.......................e..@F...../........./.........#
################################################## #####


Veto St:13 Le:17 Wi: 9 Dx:20 To:16 Ch: 7 Ap:15 Ma:14 Pe:16 N-
DV/PV: 10/4 H: -6(68) P: 29(47) Exp: 8/7456 UD: 6 Sp: 102
Stunned Burdened

Veto, the high elven druid, was killed by a leucrotta.
She scored 13944 points and advanced to level 8.
She survived for 0 years, 3 days, 0 hours, 15 minutes and 48 seconds (3957
turns).

[JellySlayer]

Was wandering around on true berserk and accidentally bumped into Hotzenplotz while I was getting the healing quest completed. Rookie mistake :p

I'll try again later when a new resolution comes through.

[stellian]

Attempting to veto the bureaucracy_should_be_as_complex_and_cumbersome_as _possible motion Sword born High Elf Druid. Oh geez...
Wha... I wouldn't even know what to do with a char like that. Good luck.

[JellySlayer]

Running a veto PC against this motion: Stellian's motion of suffrage facilitation

Sword-born dark elf merchant with a specialty in scrolls. Good times.

[edit]Bah, veto attempt #2 fails. Damn, I suck at this game now.

[Grey]

This thread has very quickly left me confused. All I got out of it is that I belong to a movement called 'camp gut'.

[gut]

it is an awesome camp indeed, though, sadly, I will never join it

long live camp grey!

[Joe]

I vote for:
Guts grey_is_a_goof motion. (3 for, passes).
Stellian's motion of suffrage facilitation (3 for, passes).
Kyreles' motion to compel voting. (3 for, passes).

I vote against:
Kyreles' motion to make Nomic a little easier (0 for, 2 against now).
Grobblewobbles 'the let's-divide-the-forum-worse-than-is-even-possible-with-TH motion' (2 for, 2 against now).

I propose:
Goal-of-the-game-motion: The goal of the game is to score 100 points. Each motion you propose will lower your amount of points by 3 but there is a minimum of zero points, the amount with which all players will start if this motion passes.
A motion that fails due to either a succesful veto or 3 negative votes will yield the proposer 15 points. A motion that fails due to any other reason will cost the proposer 10 points. A successful motion will yield to the proposer as well as to all the positive voters 4 points. Positive votes on a failing motion will cost 2 points however. A negative vote immediately yields 2 points for the caster of the vote regardless of result of the motion. A successful veto yields 10 points for the vetoer, but a failed veto-attempt will cost him 2 points.
No new methods of gaining points can be introduced as long as this motion is in effect. If this motion passes but later gets removed out of the rules again, points are being stored for an eventual later re-introduction of points in the game: they will stay until the game has ended.
If this motion is successful it is self-referring (the proposer as well as the positive voters will gain 4 points: negative voters will however not gain points because they 'immediately' gain points, but the motion wasn't in effect yet when they were casting their vote).

/edit: edited some details in the motion.

[Joe]

Attempting to veto the bureaucracy_should_be_as_complex_and_cumbersome_as _possible motion Sword born High Elf Druid. Oh geez...

Wasn't that motion thwarted by 3 negative votes already?! (not that I mind vetoing failed motions).
If it wasn't thwarted yet I vote against this motion too ;)

[_Ln_]

Voting for Joe's goal-of-the-game motion. With it in power nobody will ever win, so it's perfect ;)

[grobblewobble]

I guess I can't make a new motion before all my old motions are resolved. And I will have to vote on all open motions too, including my own, I guess. So..

I vote against Grobblewobble's 'let's-divide-the-forum-worse-than-is-even-possible-with-TH motion' (2 for, 3 against now). Motion failed.

I vote against Joe's goal-of-the-game motion. (1 for, 1 against)
I vote in favour of Kyreles' motion to make Nomic a little easier (1 for, 2 against)

The IT ARE PROOF motion: players can earn PROOF tokens for the camp they are in, be it the pro-TH camp or the anti-TH camp. To earn a PROOF token, they must create a random character and choose TH at the earliest opportunity (if pro TH) or never choose TH (if anti TH). Creation of such a character must be openly announced in this thread. Proof tokens are awarded to your camp, as follows:

If you win the game by closing the portal: +10 PROOF tokens
If you win the game by killing Andor Drakon instead: +20 PROOF tokens
If you win in less than 30.000 turns: +5 PROOF tokens
If you win in less than 5.000 turns: +20 PROOF tokens
If you win while remaining illiterate the whole game: +3 PROOF tokens
If you win while never harvesting any herbs: +4 PROOF tokens
If you win while never praying during the game or step on any altar: +5 PROOF tokens
If you win while never eating any other food than corpses: +2 PROOF tokens
If you win while having been doomed for the entire game beyond the first 50 turns: +10 PROOF tokens
If you win while immediately drinking all the booze you see (ingame): +1 PROOF token
If you are drunk while playing (real life): +1 PROOF token
If you lose the game: -3 PROOF tokens
If you rescue the puppy: +1 PROOF token
If you start the game by immediately entering the SMC and descending the UD and reach the HMV alive: +1 PROOF token
If you receive the ring of the master cat: +2 PROOF tokens
If you kill the ancient chaos wyrm: +1 PROOF token
If you rescue Khelavaster: +1 PROOF token
If you receive the platinum girdle: +10 PROOF tokens
If you slay every monster on D:50: +1 PROOF token
If you leave the chain without any corruption: +1 PROOF token
If you enter the ID at any time: -3 PROOF tokens
If you are a wizard or archer: -2 PROOF tokens
If you are a priest, necromancer, beastfighter or barbarian: -1 PROOF token
If you are a thief or merchant: +1 PROOF token
If you have the candle starsign: -1 PROOF token
If you are a drakeling: -1 PROOF token

(of course those values could be altered or expanded in future amendmends)

Members of the camp with the most proof tokens gain the exclusive right to claim SCIENTIFIC PROOF that they are right.

[JellySlayer]

Running a veto character against the proof motion. That's insanity.

Dragon-born dark elf barbarian.

[stellian]

Rules amended as per my motion of suffrage facilitation.


Rules:
&#167;001: Any player may set forth a motion to take some official action. Official actions include, but are not limited to,
amendment of or additions of rules.

&#167;002: Motions can be written in bold and / or italics for clarity, if you like. There is no set format for motions to be submitted.

&#167;003 Votes can be written in bold and / or italics for clarity, if you like. To vote in favor of or against a motion, one must declare one's vote.

&#167;004: If at any point there are three votes from three different players in favor of a motion, the motion passes and is acted upon.
If at any point there are three votes from three different players against a motion, the motion fails. If the motion passes, and
requires that the rules be amended, the motion-maker must do this as soon as possible, and post the revised ruleset. If the
motion-maker fails to do this within 48 hours of the motion's passage, the motion's state is changed, and it fails.

&#167;005 Every player has the option to veto a motion once all by himself. After posting his veto the player must create a random character. If
he manages to win the game and proves so by posting the .flg in the YAVP-forum, the motion is vetoed. If he fails, his veto fails. If the
motion is passed by acquiring 3 approving votes before the game is ended, the motion is successful and the game is of no further influence
on the motion.

&#167;006 All participants in this game of Nomic have to make a choice. Either they join the pro-treasure hunter camp, or they have to
join the anti-treasure hunter camp. Those who join the pro-treasure hunter camp have to edit their signature, adding a line that
expresses their enthusiasm about treasure hunter. It doesn't matter what exactly you say, as long as it is clear to all that you would
never give up on Treasure Hunter because it is the most awesome talent ever. Be creative!
Those who join the anti-treasure camp also have to edit their signature, adding a line to express their disgust about the most miserable
talent in ADOM, treasure hunter.

&#167;007 Each player may only propose one new motion at a time, and they can only do so if they don't already have any previous motions up for voting.

My votes:
The IT ARE PROOF motion: hell yeah (1 for, 0 against)
Goal-of-the-game-motion: hmm why not (2 for, 1 against)
Kyreles' motion to make Nomic a little easier: nope, wouldn't that slow things down? (1 for, 3 against) CANCELLED

I propose:
Stellian's motion of veto reutilization: If a motion is passed or cancelled while a player is attempting to veto it, the player may attempt to veto a different motion using the same game character.

[Kyreles]

I accidently left of my motion to compel voting on the last State of the Nomic. The new one will include it.

I vote against the Goal-of-the-game-motion
I vote against the IT ARE PROOF motion
I vote in favor of Stellian's motion of veto reutilization

JellySlayer, it seems like you are opposed to the IT ARE PROOF motion. Could you edit your post or repost to actually vote against it?


I guess I can't make a new motion before all my old motions are resolved. And I will have to vote on all open motions too, including my own, I guess. So..

By voting against your motion I take it you wish to withdraw your motion.

[Kyreles]

The State of the Nomic

Rules:

§001: Any player may set forth a motion to take some official action. Official actions include, but are not limited to, amendment of or additions of rules.

§002: Motions can be written in bold and / or italics for clarity, if you like or you can write them in an abbreviated form:
"[motion summary] motion: [description]."
Example: "Meaningless Title motion: Kyreless will be granted the meaningless title of The Creator of the Nomic." There is no set format for motions to be submitted.

§003 Votes can be written in bold and / or italics for clarity, if you like. To vote in favor of or against a motion, one must declare one's vote.

§004: If at any point there are three votes from three different players in favor of a motion, the motion passes and is acted upon. If at any point there are three votes from three different players against a motion, the motion fails. If the motion passes, and requires that the rules be amended, the motion-maker must do this as soon as possible, and post the revised ruleset. If the motion-maker fails to do this within 48 hours of the motion's passage, the motion's state is changed, and it fails.

§005 Every player the option to veto a motion once all by himself. After posting his veto the player must create a random character. If he manages to win the game and proves so by posting the .flg in the YAVP-forum, the motion is vetoed. If he fails, his veto fails. If the motion is passed by acquiring 3 approving votes before the game is ended, the motion is successful and the game is of no further influence on the motion.

§006 All participants in this game of Nomic have to make a choice. Either they join the pro-treasure hunter camp, or they have to join the anti-treasure hunter camp. Those who join the pro-treasure hunter camp have to edit their signature, adding a line that expresses their enthusiasm about treasure hunter. It doesn't matter what exactly you say, as long as it is clear to all that you would never give up on Treasure Hunter because it is the most awesome talent ever. Be creative! Those who join the anti-treasure camp also have to edit their signature, adding a line to express their disgust about the most miserable talent in ADOM, treasure hunter.

§007 Each player may only propose one new motion at a time, and they can only do so if they don't already have any previous motions up for voting.

§008 All Players are 'allowed to taunt grey in this thread'.


Open Issues:

Kyreles' motion to compel voting. (2 for, 1 against) Kyreles
Goal-of-the-game-motion (1 for, 2 against) Joe
The IT ARE PROOF motion (1 for, 1 against) grobblewobble
Stellian's motion of veto reutilization (1 for, 0 against) Stellian


If there are mistakes let me know and I'll fix it.

[grobblewobble]

By voting against your motion I take it you wish to withdraw your motion.
Redrawing my motion? That isn't even possible, there is no rule that allows it. However, there is no rule against voting in favour or against your own motions, either.

Also, Jellyslayer didn't vote against the PROOF motion, although he is attempting to veto it. So at the moment it is 1 for, 0 against.

[JellySlayer]

Also, Jellyslayer didn't vote against the PROOF motion, although he is attempting to veto it. So at the moment it is 1 for, 0 against.

grobble is correct. I am not voting for or against any motions. Just trying to veto things. My barbarian is level 14 with pyramid and griffyard completed, darkforge raided, by the way. As soon as I get to L+ I can get crowned as well.

[Kyreles]

Jellyslayer didn't vote against the PROOF motion, although he is attempting to veto it. So at the moment it is 1 for, 0 against.

I voted against it. It's 1 for, 1 against.


Redrawing my motion? That isn't even possible, there is no rule that allows it. However, there is no rule against voting in favour or against your own motions, either.

I move that players shall not be allowed to vote on their own motions. Also they shall be allowed to withdraw a motion they submitted by declaring they wish to do so. Furthermore, no player shall be allowed to vote more than once on each motion. For the purposes of voting this may be refered to as Kyreles' motion to fix the Nomic

I vote in favor of Kyreles' motion to fix the Nomic
I vote in favor of Kyreles' motion to fix the Nomic
I vote in favor of Kyreles' motion to fix the Nomic

Motion Passed.

[gut]

this game is HARD

[gut]

I think I have it figured. I was going to ask that somebody maintain a cohesive list,
and stick it at the VERY FIRST POST of this thread. That would put the burden on
only one person though, and that is not fair, and not convenient. I will post my
proposed solution in the form of a hopefully unreadable nomic motion format.

motion nomic_reform:
we create an ACCOUNT with username 'nomic'. It will have a public pass, so we
can all edit the original post. We take all this mess we have so far, stick it in an
initial post, then edit it as if it were a wiki.

Sure, this is open to mass corruption, but we could undo any problems by simply
re-scanning all the thread posts, which is what we are having to do now anyway.

[Kyreles]

My State of the Nomic posts aren't doing a good enough job? I can edit the initial post to have an updated list of rules if that's easier for everyone.

*publicly taunts Grey*

[Monk]

I vote in favor of the IT-ARE-PROOF motion.
I vote in favor of Stellian's motion of veto reutilization.
I vote against the Goal-of-the-game motion.

Goal-of-the game is now dead.

[stellian]

Open Issues:

Kyreles' motion to compel voting. (2 for, 1 against) Kyreles
Goal-of-the-game-motion (1 for, 2 against) Joe
The IT ARE PROOF motion (1 for, 1 against) grobblewobble
Stellian's motion of veto reutilization (1 for, 0 against) Stellian

So Kyreles' motion to compel voting is still open after all this time? I'm so bad at keeping track. I vote for it then. PASSED

I also vote against nomic_reform. I don't see what's so hard about simply scrolling up to the latest rules update. You shouldn't have to go back more than a page at most.


I move that players shall not be allowed to vote on their own motions. Also they shall be allowed to withdraw a motion they submitted by declaring they wish to do so. Furthermore, no player shall be allowed to vote more than once on each motion. For the purposes of voting this may be refered to as Kyreles' motion to fix the Nomic

I vote in favor of Kyreles' motion to fix the Nomic
I vote in favor of Kyreles' motion to fix the Nomic
I vote in favor of Kyreles' motion to fix the Nomic

Motion Passed.
ROFL

[grobblewobble]

I vote in favor of Kyreles' motion to fix the Nomic
I vote in favor of Kyreles' motion to fix the Nomic
I vote in favor of Kyreles' motion to fix the Nomic

Motion Passed.

Sorry Kyreles, but that doesn´t work. In the rules it does say that three different people have to vote in favour of a motion before it passes. Further, your motion to compel voting is still open to voting, which means you aren't even allowed to propose any new motions at this moment, because Stellian''s motion of Suffrage Facilitation has already been accepted. Sorry, dude.

I vote in favour of gut´s nomic_reform motion.
I vote in favour of Stellian's motion of veto reutilization

Regarding gut's idea.. while I agree that Kyreles's state-of-the-nomic helps a lot, I think a summary post on the front would be very helpful to people entering the game later, so that they don't need to read the whole thing from beginning to end to understand what is going on.

And I would like to remind gut and Jellyslayer that participants are required to choose a side in the TH wars now and update their signature accordingly. *smiles sweetly*

[Monk]

I vote vote in favor of gut's nomic_reform motion.

I is doin it rite?

[stellian]

Sorry Kyreles, but that doesn&#180;t work. In the rules it does say that three different people have to vote in favour of a motion before it passes. Further, your motion to compel voting is still open to voting, which means you aren't even allowed to propose any new motions at this moment, because Stellian''s motion of Suffrage Facilitation has already been accepted. Sorry, dude.
Kyreles' motion to compel voting has now been accepted. He should be able to propose his motion to fix the Nomic again once he updates the rules. And also vote for it. :/

[Joe]

Yeah, that was blatant rule violation :p

I vote against:
Kyreles' motion to fix the Nomic: status pending because it was proposed illegally. But if it were legal I would vote against it ;)
The IT ARE PROOF motion (2 for, 1 against) grobblewobble - Way too much to read or put into rules ;)
Stellian's motion of veto reutilization (2 for, 0 against) Stellian - Vote against. One could start hoarding up powerful random characters for emergency vetos and it's way too hard to check. If anything like this passes, it should be restricted to motions that are open when the character is created or it will be abused like hell ;)

I vote for:
motion nomic_reform (2 for, 1 against) gut - passed!

I propose the following motion:
Restricted-actions-motion: A player that proposes a motion is not allowed to vote on it, attempt to veto it or withdraw it. A player that votes on a motion is not allowed to veto it and a player attempting to veto a motion is not allowed to vote on it. Every player always is entitled to interact with every motion just once, where there currently exists 3 types of interaction: proposing, voting (positive or negative) and vetoing.

And indeed: gut and Jellyslayer should be punished for infringing the rules regarding their non-TH-signatures. Either they should stay out of the thread or get a motion passed to remove the rule about it: before that's done one has to abide the rules!

[Kyreles]

I move that players shall not be allowed to vote on their own motions. Also they shall be allowed to withdraw a motion they submitted by declaring they wish to do so. Furthermore, no player shall be allowed to vote more than once on each motion. For the purposes of voting this may be refered to as Kyreles' motion to fix the Nomic

I cast my vote agasint Joe's Restricted-actions-motion
I cast my vote in favor of Kyreles' motion to fix the nomic.

[Kyreles]

The State of the Nomic

Rules:

§001: Any player may set forth a motion to take some official action. Official actions include, but are not limited to, amendment of or additions of rules.

§002: Motions can be written in bold and / or italics for clarity, if you like or you can write them in an abbreviated form:
"[motion summary] motion: [description]."
Example: "Meaningless Title motion: Kyreless will be granted the meaningless title of The Creator of the Nomic." There is no set format for motions to be submitted.

§003 Votes can be written in bold and / or italics for clarity, if you like. To vote in favor of or against a motion, one must declare one's vote.

§004: If at any point there are three votes from three different players in favor of a motion, the motion passes and is acted upon. If at any point there are three votes from three different players against a motion, the motion fails. If the motion passes, and requires that the rules be amended, the motion-maker must do this as soon as possible, and post the revised ruleset. If the motion-maker fails to do this within 48 hours of the motion's passage, the motion's state is changed, and it fails.

§005 Every player has the option to veto a motion once all by himself. After posting his veto the player must create a random character. If he manages to win the game and proves so by posting the .flg in the YAVP-forum, the motion is vetoed. If he fails, his veto fails. If the motion is passed by acquiring 3 approving votes before the game is ended, the motion is successful and the game is of no further influence on the motion.

§006 All participants in this game of Nomic have to make a choice. Either they join the pro-treasure hunter camp, or they have to join the anti-treasure hunter camp. Those who join the pro-treasure hunter camp have to edit their signature, adding a line that expresses their enthusiasm about treasure hunter. It doesn't matter what exactly you say, as long as it is clear to all that you would never give up on Treasure Hunter because it is the most awesome talent ever. Be creative! Those who join the anti-treasure camp also have to edit their signature, adding a line to express their disgust about the most miserable talent in ADOM, treasure hunter.

§007 Each player may only propose one new motion at a time, and they can only do so if they don't already have any previous motions up for voting.

§008 All Players are 'allowed to taunt grey in this thread'.

§009 In order to introduce a motion you must have voted on all outstanding motions

§010 If a motion is passed or cancelled while a player is attempting to veto it, the player may attempt to veto a different motion using the same game character.

§011 We create an ACCOUNT with username 'nomic'. It will have a public pass, so we can all edit the original post. We take all this mess we have so far, stick t in an initial post, then edit it as if it were a wiki.


Open Issues:

Restricted-actions-motion (0 for, 1 against)Joe
Kyreles' motion to fix the Nomic (1 for, 0 against) Kyreles
IT ARE PROOF motion (2 for, 2 against) grobblewobble


If there are mistakes let me know and I'll fix it.

[stellian]

Stellian's motion of veto reutilization (2 for, 0 against) Stellian - Vote against. One could start hoarding up powerful random characters for emergency vetos and it's way too hard to check. If anything like this passes, it should be restricted to motions that are open when the character is created or it will be abused like hell ;)
Isn't the current veto system already quite abusable as it is?

Oops, I didn't realize my motion of veto reutilization had already passed already (Kyreles, Monk and grobblewobble voted for it). Thanks Kyreles for updating the rules accordingly.

And Kyreles, I might be mistaken, but I count 2 votes for the IT ARE PROOF motion (from Monk and myself) and 2 against (yours and Joe's). It should be kept in the list of open motions.

We need some sort of sanction system for rule breakers like gut, Jellyslayer and myself. I propose... oh wait.

Kyreles' motion to fix the Nomic (1 for, 0 against) I vote for it.
Restricted-actions-motion (0 for, 1 against) I vote against it. I would vote for it if you could vote against a motion and try to veto it at the same time. Actually, I'll try to veto it as well while I still can. My char is a... ugh. Sword-born drakish Necromancer. >.<

Okay, I propose stellian's motion of guilt and shame: Whoever breaks the rules shall be given a humorous title or nickname that will be used in place of their username for the rest of the game (for example, "Stellian the wannabe cat lord"). The first title or nickname to be proposed stays.

[stellian]

Actually, I'll try to veto it as well while I still can. My char is a... ugh. Sword-born drakish Necromancer. >.<
And this is what I get for starting the game in the Small Cave.


Veetoe, the drakish necromancer, was killed by a ratling archer skeleton.
He scored 2104 points.
He survived for 0 years, 1 day, 3 hours, 44 minutes and 46 seconds (722
turns).
Veetoe visited 2 places.
His charisma score was modified by +1 during his career.
His perception score was modified by +1 during his career.
He ended his adventuring life in a small cave.
5 monsters perished under his attacks.
He possessed the following intrinsic:
He was stun resistant (gained through an item).
He had the following talents: Alert, Charming.
He had a final speed score of 100 (final base speed: 100).
He was not particularly religious.
He did not ask for divine help.
He was chaotically aligned.

The following monsters were vanquished:
1 goblin rockthrower
1 kobold
3 orcs

[grobblewobble]

It may be best to spread the public password for the Nomic account by PM, not announce in the open. Otherwise a spambot might start using it.

Errr.. that was just a suggestion, not a motion! :p

[stellian]

How is the "Nomic" user going to be able to make an "initial" post anyway?

[stellian]

How is the "Nomic" user going to be able to make an "initial" post anyway?
Nevermind, I got it. They should create a new thread, right?

[Monk]

I vote for Kyreles' motion to fix the Nomic (2 for, 0 against)
I vote for stellian's motion of guilt and shame (1 for, 0 against)

Furthermore, I veto the restricted-actions-motion. Char is... Wand-born Dwarfish Monk. Not bad.

[Monk]

Nope:


Vito Skel, the dwarven monk, was killed by a cave lizard.
She scored 2511 points and advanced to level 6.
She survived for 0 years, 1 day, 12 hours, 13 minutes and 32 seconds (997
turns).
Vito Skel visited 3 places.
Her strength score was modified by +1 during her career.
Her dexterity score was modified by +1 during her career.
Her toughness score was modified by +1 during her career.
Her perception score was modified by +1 during her career.
She ended her adventuring life on level 4 of some ancient caves.
63 monsters perished under her attacks.
She possessed the following intrinsic:
She was cursed.
She had the following talents: Brawler, Healthy, Porter.
She had a final speed score of 103 (final base speed: 103).
She was religious.
She did not ask for divine help.
She was lawfully aligned.

The following monsters were vanquished:
1 black hurthling
1 bugbear
1 giant lizard
19 giant rats
1 goblin
1 goblin chieftain
1 goblin rockthrower
1 gremlin
1 hobgoblin
1 kobold
2 large bats
4 orcs
25 rats
2 skeletons
2 wererats

[gut]

there are too many 'motion to fix the Nomic' motions. It is confusing.

[grobblewobble]

There is an error in the Nomic post. Kyreles's motion to fix the nomic has received positive votes from Kyreles, Stellian and Monk and is therefore already accepted.

I vote in favour of Joe's restricted action motion.
I vote against Stellian's motion of guilt and shame.

Will update the Nomic post now. I think that it would help to show who voted to reduce the confusion, so I'll add that.

[Kyreles]

I move that players shall recieve one point for each motion that is passed, and shall lose one point for each infraction of the rules. The State of the Nomic much now include a listing of points. This shall only apply to motions applied after the creation of this rule. For the purposes of voting this may be refered to as Kyreles' motion to insert a plot.

I vote against stellian's motion of guilt and shame

The State of the Nomic

Rules:

§001: Any player may set forth a motion to take some official action. Official actions include, but are not limited to, amendment of or additions of rules.

§002: Motions can be written in bold and / or italics for clarity, if you like or you can write them in an abbreviated form:
"[motion summary] motion: [description]."
Example: "Meaningless Title motion: Kyreless will be granted the meaningless title of The Creator of the Nomic." There is no set format for motions to be submitted.

§003 Votes can be written in bold and / or italics for clarity, if you like. To vote in favor of or against a motion, one must declare one's vote.

§004: If at any point there are three votes from three different players in favor of a motion, the motion passes and is acted upon. If at any point there are three votes from three different players against a motion, the motion fails. If the motion passes, and requires that the rules be amended, the motion-maker must do this as soon as possible, and post the revised ruleset. If the motion-maker fails to do this within 48 hours of the motion's passage, the motion's state is changed, and it fails.

§005 Every player has the option to veto a motion once all by himself. After posting his veto the player must create a random character. If he manages to win the game and proves so by posting the .flg in the YAVP-forum, the motion is vetoed. If he fails, his veto fails. If the motion is passed by acquiring 3 approving votes before the game is ended, the motion is successful and the game is of no further influence on the motion.

§006 All participants in this game of Nomic have to make a choice. Either they join the pro-treasure hunter camp, or they have to join the anti-treasure hunter camp. Those who join the pro-treasure hunter camp have to edit their signature, adding a line that expresses their enthusiasm about treasure hunter. It doesn't matter what exactly you say, as long as it is clear to all that you would never give up on Treasure Hunter because it is the most awesome talent ever. Be creative! Those who join the anti-treasure camp also have to edit their signature, adding a line to express their disgust about the most miserable talent in ADOM, treasure hunter.

§007 Each player may only propose one new motion at a time, and they can only do so if they don't already have any previous motions up for voting.

§008 All Players are 'allowed to taunt grey in this thread'.

§009 In order to introduce a motion you must have voted on all outstanding motions

§010 If a motion is passed or cancelled while a player is attempting to veto it, the player may attempt to veto a different motion using the same game character.

§011 We create an ACCOUNT with username 'nomic'. It will have a public pass, so we can all edit the original post. We take all this mess we have so far, stick t in an initial post, then edit it as if it were a wiki.

§012 Players shall not be allowed to vote on their own motions. Also they shall be allowed to withdraw a motion they submitted by declaring they wish to do so. Furthermore, no player shall be allowed to vote more than once on each motion


Open Issues:

Restricted-actions-motion (1 for, 2 against) Joe
IT ARE PROOF motion (2 for, 2 against) grobblewobble
stellian's motion of guilt and shame (1 for, 2 against) stellian
Kyreles' motion to insert a plot (0 for, 0 against) Kyreles


If there are mistakes let me know and I'll fix it.

[Monk]

I am making a veto attempt on Kyreles' motion to insert a plot.

Candle-born Trollish Weaponsmith. Nice!

[Monk]

Already failed, I'm too ashamed to say how. Let's just say that I get bored very quickly playing trolls.

[JellySlayer]

I will be running a veto character against Kyreles' motion to insert a plot (I know I already have another veto running against a different motion, but it's not on this computer).

Sword (again?) high elf barbarian. Interesting. I definitely have never played this combination before. I have 19 starting Le...

[Molach]

Hm, what is this?

I vote in favor of Kyreles' motion to insert a plot.
I vote against Stellian's motion of guilt and shame.
I vote in favor of Joe's Restiricted action motion.

Let me think about that proof thing a bit more...

I now have to update the score on the talkly-nomic post?

[gut]

i also running veto PC agains kyreles' INSTERT A PLOT abomination... on the server if it is up

[JellySlayer]

The motion entitled: The IT ARE PROOF motion has been vetoed (http://www.adom.de/forums/showthread.php/11723-YAVP-Veto-the-Dark-Elf-Barbarian?p=66753#post66753).

[JellySlayer]

The motion entitled: Kyreles' motion to insert a plot has been vetoed (http://www.adom.de/forums/showthread.php/11724-YAVP-Veto2-The-High-Elf-Barbarian?p=66762#post66762).

[Silfir]

I was wondering how the treasure hunter messages ended up in all of the signatures. I completely forgot about this thread.

I vote against Joe's motion of restricted action.
I vote against stellian's motion of guilt and shame.

Pick Nose motion: I motion that Pick Pockets be renamed "Pick Nose". Every use of Pick Pockets (Pick Nose, after passing the motion) in-game must be accompanied by the participant picking his or her out-of-game nose. Items obtained through Pick Pockets (Pick Nose) in-game must be renamed in context and conversation to include a nose-related play on words.

For instance, the bracers of war could be referred to as the boogers of war. A potion of booze could be referred to as a potion of sneeze, and so forth.

[JellySlayer]

I will be running a veto character against the pick nose motion.

I rolled a Sword-born hurthling monk.

[edit]Dead.

[gut]

wait, this means that my veto PC has been vetoed...

wait, no it doesn't. I remember there was some rule, somewhere, that allows me to
use this PC to veto a seperate motion??? Maybe?

I don't know what to veto though, so I will just win, then cancel whatever comes
along that I don't like.

[_Ln_]

Are you guys using Nomic as an excuse to play adom? :) It's not like there are game-breaking motions that will benefit some Nomic players.

[JellySlayer]

Are you guys using Nomic as an excuse to play adom? :)

Maybe.....

[grobblewobble]

I vote in favor of Silfir's nose pick motion.

So many motions shot down.. this should be a little harder.

The dog motion: I make a motion that from now on, vetoes are no valid unless the veto character rescued the cute dog, obtained the axe of the minotaur emperor and finishes by killing Andor Drakon.

Vote quickly, before it's vetoed! ;)

[JellySlayer]

I think it's pretty obvious what I'm going to say here ;)

Lucky for you, it's a Raven-born grey elf thief going for Veto on The Dog Motion.

[edit]Lucky for me, I have 3 starting talents.
[edit2]I also vote against The Dog Motion.
[edit3]Shoot. Died. Maybe I'll run another character later.

[_Ln_]

The dog motion: I make a motion that from now on, vetoes are no valid unless the veto character rescued the cute dog, obtained the axe of the minotaur emperor and finishes by killing Andor Drakon.

I rather think it will only encourage people more.

[gut]

I already have an uber powered necro about to descend on the final CoC dive to close the gate.
If I could just get the server to stop lagging I could veto this abomination in under an hour. As
it is I will prolly have to play off-and-on spurts and maybe veto it around midnight :D

[Monk]

I vote against the Pick Nose motion.
I vote against the Dog motion.

Furthermore, I veto the Dog motion.

Char is... Tree-born High Elven Fighter. Meh.

Edit: Dead. Stupid ants.

[Monk]

Now vetoing the Pick Nose motion.

Crap. Sword-born Hurthling Assassin. Female, what's more.

Edit: Dead. Pit vipers this time.

[Roarke]

I vote against the Pick Nose motion. (1/2)
I vote against the Dog Motion. (1/3) Motion denied.

The Doom or Die motion: I propose a motion that prohibits veto characters from removing any doom status that they acquire over the course of the game. They are not required to become doomed, but if it should happen for any reason, it cannot be removed. In practical terms, this means:
1. Once doomed, no more sacrificing to your god at "very close" piety.
2. Once doomed, no drinking from pools.
3. Once doomed, no eating karmic beings.

The penalty for breaking this rule for veto characters is, of course, death.
A veto character may avoid his penalty by simply becoming doomed again or clearing the game within 100 turns.

[JellySlayer]

Sure, I'll vote for the Doom or Die motion. I love playing doomed.

[edit]

I haven't voted for the Pick Nose motion, yet, apparently, so I'll vote against that and defeat it.
I don't know what other motions are still out there, but I vote against all of the rest.

I'll also add a new motion:

The Motion on Self-Referential Motions

1. All new motions must either refer to themselves or to the Motion on Self-Referential Motions. Any motion that does not refer either to itself or to the Motion on Self-Referential Motions is automatically vetoed.

[Henri]

Can I join the Nomic?

Where is the Full Ruleset?

[Henri]

I make a motion to establish a ruleset location. The ruleset will be located on the first post of this thread which will be updated by Kyreles. For the purposes of this voting, this motion shall be referred to as Henri's motion to establish the Official Ruleset Location.

[Henri]

I make a motion for a rule that states: In order for a proposal to be enacted, the number of votes for the proposal shall be greater than or equal to the quorum (half of the number of total players rounded up). In order for a proposal to be failed, the number of votes against the proposal shall be greater than or equal to the quorum. For the purposes of this voting, this motion shall be referred to as Henri's motion to establish the voting quorum.

[gut]

i make motion

motion to delete nomic thread

[Henri]

I vote against gut's motion to delete nomic thread

[JellySlayer]

gut and Henri, I don't believe you can make a motion until you have voted on all outstanding motions (#9).

[gut]

i vote for everything, including my own motion to ban nomic from adom forums

i will create 3 new accounts to pass it if i need to