Monsters which do not have a 'type'

[magpie]

I just found out (trying to get into Darkforge with a High Elf Archer) that wall beasts are not vulnerable to construct-slaying ammunition, and I assume that living walls are also not vulnerable to them.

An unpleasant surprise: I am going to need those two quarrels to harm the Steel Golems in DF, and the wall beast took away 65 of my 68 HP with two thrown rocks (and I have 15 PV!).

I don't have any spells or (reliable) wands to kill it, either: I could try to ball lightning it, but that would more likely end up with me electrocuting myself with a 8 or 2 result.

Does anyone know of other types of monsters which are not 'typed': that is, are not vulnerable to a specific type of slaying weapon?

[Overheat]

IIRC, there is no beast slaying ammo, so any monster that is only a beast.

[magpie]

So we have:

Wall beasts
Living walls
'Beasts' - wolves, jackals, bears ...

Anything else?

[Stingray1]

Mimics, rust monsters, carrion crawlers(?), grues, snakes, bats, sharks, eels, cats. Some are beasts I suppose.

[Moeba]

Aren't grues demons?

[Stingray1]

Aren't grues demons?

I also used to think so, but in a recent game I was using a demon slaying weapon against them with a Healer( so I could check damage ) and it seems that they aren't.

They are merely grues.

Edit - But, I am not a math expert, so don't quote me on it. :)

[Soirana]

They are merely grues.


Pretty sure they are constructs, but I am also dead sure they actually were demon constructs prior to these prereleases.

On other hand I do not think slaying is checked by weapon damage, you either get guaranteed crit or not.

[Silfir]

I also remember that grues are vulnerable to demon slaying, maybe it was changed (though why I couldn't guess). Like Soirana said, though, slaying just means automatic criticals - you don't need to be a healer to check for it, because not receiving a critical proves the weapon doesn't slay, and in turn if you keep attacking the monster and never don't get a critical, it's probably slaying.

Carrion crawlers count as insects, don't they?

[Mobius]

Perhaps arrows / bows of Hunting should slay beasts?

[Stingray1]

Pretty sure they are constructs, but I am also dead sure they actually were demon constructs prior to these prereleases.

On other hand I do not think slaying is checked by weapon damage, you either get guaranteed crit or not.

Oh, well. Maybe I'm totally mistaken, it wasn't an official study I did, just something that stuck way back in the back of my head.

Construct? I wonder why the heck they would be classed as that, so that would mean that something made them. I always thought of them as something more 'natural'.
Like a gremlin just much more vicious.

[Soirana]

Oh, well. Maybe I'm totally mistaken, it wasn't an official study I did, just something that stuck way back in the back of my head.

Construct? I wonder why the heck they would be classed as that, so that would mean that something made them. I always thought of them as something more 'natural'.
Like a gremlin just much more vicious.

I always imagined elemental grues being like.... more or less non life stuff [or more like collection of unlife stuff] being possessed by demon spirit. Sort of animated armor just with demon controlling it.

[_Ln_]

I've just cleaned up (to the extent of my knowledge + available tests) wiki monster page (http://ancardia.wikia.com/wiki/Monsters) throwing out untameable beasts from "Beast/Animal" type (there is some confusion about the extent of this group. If anyone has information about common properties of fantastic beasts - gorgons, dorn beasts, hydras etc. please share it).

In any case, things not vulnerable to slaying include the following:
tameable beasts (without insects)
fantastic beasts ('F') except harpies
fantastic canines ('d') - cooshoos, hell hounds
magical eyes ('e')
mimics ('m')
rust monsters ('R')
will o'wisp
wall beast
living wall
unicorns ('U')
chaos spawn
fire drake
stone snake
vapor rat (unless it's slayed by Cat's Claw, don't have it)

I've got some doubts about carrion crawler being an insect (don't have Bugbiter either, so can't test).
I've also have doubts about Keriax being a demon, because I distinctly remember some problems with slaying ammunition in one of my last fights with him.

[Soirana]

I've got some doubts about carrion crawler being an insect (don't have Bugbiter either, so can't test).
I've also have doubts about Keriax being a demon, because I distinctly remember some problems with slaying ammunition in one of my last fights with him.

To my limited knowledge crawler is not insect and Keriax is not demon, although I am only about 90% sure.

Chaos spawns not being humanoids is rather strange.

[Stingray1]

I always imagined elemental grues being like.... more or less non life stuff [or more like collection of unlife stuff] being possessed by demon spirit. Sort of animated armor just with demon controlling it.

2077

Mmm, interesting. It sounds like blurring fishy thing. Some prehistoric amphibious creature.

[Alucard]

In 1.1.1, at least, Keriax is only vulnerable to dragon slaying, and grues are constructs and demons.

[Stingray1]

To my limited knowledge crawler is not insect and Keriax is not demon, although I am only about 90% sure.

Chaos spawns not being humanoids is rather strange.

Well, Carrion crawlers are represented by a green c, which according to the Manual are centipedes. I guess in ADOM centipedes might also count as insects. Does Spiders count as insects?

Chaos spawns' Monster memory doesn't sound like they are humanoid. A C is merely a Chaos Creature according to the manual.

I am 100% sure that Keriax is a Multi-headed Dragon. Sorry couldn't resist using the symbol for food in the finally fixed forum.

[_Ln_]

Pretty sure spiders are not insects in ADOM.

Centipedes are insects in ADOM, despite that they are not in RL. (kudos to wikipedia, makes sense taking into account that loads of legs are more than 6).

Tried every 1.1.1 slaying ammo on chaos spawns before when posting RFE about making them jellies, nothing (no vulnerabilities, that is).

Wikipedia even has a page (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grue_(monster)) about grues, but honestly nothing there hints on semi-construct nature. Perhaps we should simply ask TB? My vote is on symmetry in elemental temples - demonic demons, construct elementals and demonic construct grues.

[Silfir]

I've always understood the grues as a creature brought to life by the corruption of the element of the Chaos Orb in question - and as such part elemental. Elementals count as magical constructs in ADOM. Ln is definitely onto something: Every orb is protected by some as of yet uncorrupted and therefore non-demonic elementals, some fully living demons belonging to the armies of cHaOs, and the grues, who are ... something inbetween. Corruption does weird and scary things.

In the monster memory, grues are described as beast-like creatures - and perhaps one of the parts that goes into making a grue is a living creature. We use "unlife" as a synonym for constructs in ADOM, but it might not be all that clear-cut.

[magpie]

We use "unlife" as a synonym for constructs in ADOM, but it might not be all that clear-cut.

Yeah, think of what are commonly called Cthulhu mythos monsters (byakhees, shoggoths, Hounds of Tindalos ... ) for a good example.

I see grues as being somewhat akin to those kinds of monsters.

In Zork (at least), grues have a home world, but what's to say they have anything in common with life like, say, all the PC races, or common beasts?