Metal confusion

[blunk]

So it seems the silver headgear is made of iron.


diadem of beauty silver diadem 35s [+0,+0] {Ap+4} iron HM(+0,1d3)
helm of beauty silver helmet 50s [+0,+0] {Ap+1} iron H(+0,1d4) M(+0,1d3)
helm of leadership silver helmet 100s [+1,+2] {Ch+6} iron H(+0,1d4) M(+0,1d3)

Is this a linguistic error where they should be described as "silvery helmet/diadem" ?
or
Is silver generally considered to corrode in adom and this was a short cut taken instead of making a second corrodable metal?

[TheCableGuy]

There's a alot of random inconsistencies/absurdities like that in this game.
Kind of lazy programing to me.Bugs the hell out of me.
I mean, They could of just been Mithril if they didn't want to add in silver as another metal.

[anon123]

Is this a linguistic error where they should be described as "silvery helmet/diadem" ?
or
Is silver generally considered to corrode in adom and this was a short cut taken instead of making a second corrodable metal?

The first if applicable, the second otherwise... or at least that's the only way I have to explain "silver" and "steel" amulets being both made of iron ;)

And let's not forget about the Iron Crown of Havlor, actually eternium...

[kuniqs]

The core of the helmet is made of iron. The silver part is ornamental. The same can be said about 'steel' amulets.
(Don't get me started on moloch armor, which is the size of a house and weights 3/4 of a ton. How do you 'wear' it? Do you ride in it?)

[auricbond]

The core of the helmet is made of iron. The silver part is ornamental. The same can be said about 'steel' amulets.
(Don't get me started on moloch armor, which is the size of a house and weights 3/4 of a ton. How do you 'wear' it? Do you ride in it?)

Guess it's an ancardian mech.

[fir]

So it seems the silver headgear is made of iron.


diadem of beauty silver diadem 35s [+0,+0] {Ap+4} iron HM(+0,1d3)
helm of beauty silver helmet 50s [+0,+0] {Ap+1} iron H(+0,1d4) M(+0,1d3)
helm of leadership silver helmet 100s [+1,+2] {Ch+6} iron H(+0,1d4) M(+0,1d3)

Is this a linguistic error where they should be described as "silvery helmet/diadem" ?
or
Is silver generally considered to corrode in adom and this was a short cut taken instead of making a second corrodable metal?

think they should be really in silver if so, if they are iron this is maybe not a bug but kinda shortcoming
anyway smithing in adom if fine, such things as alchemy, thievery mining, gemology, smithing are all very fine i would need more like that imo there should be option for building own housen in wilderness) also cooking could be someway extended to make better meals, sell it tame monsters maybe

[sylph]

There's no linguistic error in saying 'the silver helmet was made of iron', just as there's no error in saying 'the silver dress was made of sequins and charmeuse'.

[blunk]

There's no linguistic error in saying 'the silver helmet was made of iron', just as there's no error in saying 'the silver dress was made of sequins and charmeuse'.

I've read a bit on it and I would have expected "the silver coloured helmet was made of iron" probably because thats the common way to distinguish colour from actual material in my language.
Thanks for the clarifying.

[sweetnothing]

What is your language, blunk? Just interested, in my native language (Russian) "silver" has one of meanings "silver-colored"; I thought this is true for most of European languages. So "the silver helmet was made of iron" is perfectly correct and meaningful statement in Russian. Although I cannot object that there is a little paradox in it.

[blunk]

What is your language, blunk? Just interested, in my native language (Russian) "silver" has one of meanings "silver-colored"; I thought this is true for most of European languages. So "the silver helmet was made of iron" is perfectly correct and meaningful statement in Russian. Although I cannot object that there is a little paradox in it.

Swedish, we also use (and maybe more often even) "the silvery helmet".
To say silver helmet of a helmet not made of silver is more kid/childish speak.

On very rare occasions it could also be something that once was made of silver/gold and got replaced and the name sticks.

[Blasphemous]

In my native language (Polish) saying silver *something* - helmet, ring, necklace - means it's made of silver.
On the other hand we have something that could be translated as "silvery" which in turn would mean an item made of some material (like iron) but coated with a layer of silver.
Thus, silver to me means the actual type of metal, not color.
As a side note, when something has a glittering look, we usually say it's metallic and that is a color reference.

[_Ln_]

This topic showcases a great value of ADOM (and early RPGs and adventure games) as a motivation to learn and improve your knowledge of a foreign language. ;)

Back to the matter at hand: probably only a professional linguist will shed some light on how this works (funny how people discussing it are from Sweden, Eastern Europe and Russia). Back from my English classes I remember a discussion about "gold" vs. "golden" for a internal (material) vs. external (color and stuff) features of an object. Quick googling tells me that the distinction is not strict and mostly the meaning should be guessed from context. I believe for silver there is not additional word (except silvery which sounds pretty lame if you ask me). Again, I'm not an expert, let alone native speaker. However, there is no context in ADOM. You just find items and don't have any extended descriptions. For newly added Mist Elves this is a big deal.

That's why my opinion is that all one-word descriptions should be brought to a single rule. You have a silver amulet (protection) which is made of gold, but a silver helmet is made of iron. They should be either both made of gold or both made of iron. ADOM is complicated enough without this mess.

I believe someone has already compiled various material-related RFEs in one package. If not, it should be done and expanded to cover all cases and finally presented to TB (if we ever get new updates).

[kuniqs]

So, what does 'silver something' mean in German?

BTW. There is no 'silver' material in ADOM. There is already a wide array of materials, each with its own resistances to various types of item destruction damage. Adding more materials would exchange one confusing situation with another.

[_Ln_]

BTW. There is no 'silver' material in ADOM. There is already a wide array of materials, each with its own resistances to various types of item destruction damage. Adding more materials would exchange one confusing situation with another.

Precious metals (actual platinum and actual silver) are represented in ADOM as made of gold. No need to add anything new. Except ingots to smith it all up. Weaponsmiths go wild in the Casino FTW.

[JellySlayer]

You could just use metallurgy skill to figure this all out...

[fir]

I've read a bit on it and I would have expected "c probably because thats the common way to distinguish colour from actual material in my language.
Thanks for the clarifying.

in my language translation of it would be sorta wrong (very doubtfull at least )

if someone here says "silver item" it means item made from silver though it may eventually fall-back to the item that only looks silver way but this fallback is like "achh he says silver but means silver lookin" and without context silver item meand silver made item as i said, fallback meaning avaliable but sorta-right sorta-wrong (something like archiaic modes, need explanations ot "thinking thru" by the reader to remember this meand here only silver lookin) Wonder if in other language it is the same or another, maybe in another language accents/weights lay another way in Polish i would say saying silver sword on sword that is only looking silver is not appropriate (if no way of checking that it is not silver everyone would thing this is silver, if there is a way of checking that it is another material, man must note that it is kinda freak 'sliver' sword)

[kuniqs]

Race: High Elf
Hair: Blonde

But my Hairdressering skill tells me Hair is made from Kreatine!

[sweetnothing]

probably only a professional linguist will shed some light on how this works

Ha, linguist? I have one by hand. His name is "Dictionary". I have intentionally checked out "silver" in there. :)