Shop Question

[myrddin]

When a shop is generated in a dungeon - do the items in the shop still follow the same rules for item creation in the dungeon itself or does it have the chance of generating any item of the shop type?

[Sradac]

If a shop is generated, the following types may be, The numbers are the chance out of 20


Scrolls 5
Potions 4
General 3
Rings 3
Wands 2
Books 2
Pets 1

shops have a about a 1/6 chance to be generated then the type is picked. Supposedly for merchants the chance for them being generated is 1/4 but i dont play merchants so I cant confirm that.

[Doalag]

With a char, close to 60 places visited, let remove about 15 standard so 45 places visited and not a single shop generated, 1/6 you say? So 5/6 chance it isn't. For 45 places it's about 1/4000 chance it happens, weird! My char has really bad luck!!

[myrddin]

Sardac - what you responded to is not what I'm asking at all...

Im asking WHEN a shop is generated do the ITEMS IN THE SHOP adhere to the same rules as normal dungeon item generation.

For example - you enter D1 and a shop IS generated. Let's say it's a tome shop. When you go into that shop will only tomes for low level spells be generated or would you have a chance of finding ANY tome in the game in that shop?

[Sradac]

im pretty sure certain tomes are rarer than others, in all the tome shops ive found on all levels I'll see lots of magic missles lights and darkness, some rarer ones like strength of atlas and earthquake, from what I've seen and heard wish can never be generated but that might be wrong. I just each tome has a rarity factor for shops. I've found acid bolt and improved fireball in shops, bought them, and they were never generated again.

[Pustka]

they seem to be affected by the danger lvl of dungeon. ive had a ring of immunity in a generated shop in deep CoC. on the other had i also encountered Black Tome in a generated shop in UD but Black Tome is not so good artifact. Beside the Black Tome i havent seen artifacts in shops generated close to surface. and about other items i cant really recall were they that much better in the deeper shops, but i would guess they were :P

[Elone]

Earlier, when I had a plenty of wishes (and saved my game), I decided to test it. I wished for a plenty of scrolls of danger, and I cursed them (they're stronger like that). I have read a several til I got the room to a danger level to that of chaos gate level (just to mention, this was a tome shop generated on D1). Spellbooks of light and darkness stopped appearing in favour of stronger books like Petrification and Death Ray. If you have a way to get Scrolls of Danger, honest or not, using them will allow you to buy outstanding items in any shop.

[myrddin]

Elone -

Thanks for your response. So it does seem like DL of the dungeon level does affect the items generated in a shop.
In my current game, which Im not that far into yet, Ive had quite a number of dungeon shops generated already.
General Shops on PC1 and UD7
Potion Shops on UD1 and UD6
Wand Shop on UD2
Tome Shop on D3

Seems rather high, although the UD is supposed to generate more features then other dungeons.

BTW - how did you curse your scrolls of danger that you wished for?

[Nurgle]

dip them in a bottle of unholy (cursed) water

[Elone]

Dip an item, any item, into a ! potion of unholy water. They will rarely be found in dungeons. You cannot make them by yourself, unless you get a god to curse your whole inventory - not reccomended. To make more ! unholy water, dip existing ! water potions into an ! unholy one. You can only dip 4 at the time, meaning that you get a net gain of 3, per a waste of one ! water potion. Try that. And remember to drop those ! potions before you read a ? Scroll of Uncursing.

[Epythic]

Earlier, when I had a plenty of wishes (and saved my game), I decided to test it. I wished for a plenty of scrolls of danger, and I cursed them (they're stronger like that). I have read a several til I got the room to a danger level to that of chaos gate level (just to mention, this was a tome shop generated on D1). Spellbooks of light and darkness stopped appearing in favour of stronger books like Petrification and Death Ray. If you have a way to get Scrolls of Danger, honest or not, using them will allow you to buy outstanding items in any shop.

How many ?oD did you need?

In a !shop, it should be possible to generate cure-corruption potions, right?
In a =shop, it should be possible to get nice =oDS, right?

[kupiko]

In a !shop, it should be possible to generate cure-corruption potions, right?
In a =shop, it should be possible to get nice =oDS, right?

Well i know it's possible to get SoCR in scroll shop that's pretty outstanding.

[Doalag]

For PoCC I read in a forum they was level 1 or 2, for scrolls I don't know.

About corruption I read in a guidebook stuff about writing set and SoCR, are priest get same advantages than wizards?

[Elone]

Listen. Shops will generate same items that you would run into while adventuring. Let's assume things a bit.
There's 1% chance to get a RoDS on the ground of the dungeon level that you are on. It has the same amount of chance to be generated in the shop that lies on the same danger level. If the chance is indeed 1%, and if the shop has 25 squares, there's 25% chance that there will be one such ring generated in the shop (because it will have 1% chance to be generated on each square of the shop).

If RoDS and SoCR and PoGA are already very rare, and they are... No matter the shop, if dungeon level is correct, they have a chance to be generated. Just, chances will be as tiny as if you were adventuring.

Bah. In other words, shops basically generate random drops that correspond to current dungeon level. End of story.

To answer Epythic:
Blessed Scrolls of Danger increase Danger Level by 1d2, uncursed increase by 2d2, and cursed increase by 3d2. Enjoy.

[gut]

I do believe that all spellbooks are DL 1. There are
some that are more rare than others, but still at
danger level 1. If you climb the stairs of the ID
levels 1 and 2, you will encounter spellbooks of
death ray, earthquake, petrification, mystic shovel,
and so on. They are rare, but they are there.

The wish spellbook could be found in shops as
late as ADOM 1.0.0. I think. I haven't encountered
any in ADOM 1.1.1 yet though.

[Elone]

Actually. Their DL means that they will most likely be found on those danger levels. If RoDS is DL8, that means that you will most likely find it on DL8! So a shop generated on DL8 is most likely to sell one. Which doesnt mean that RoDS has not chance to appear on DL 1-45. Same for books. Imagine that Death ray is DL45. It will still have minor chances to appear on DL1 level, but DL1 books like Light and Darkness will be so much more favoured by RNG. Again, try reading all those cursed Danger scrolls on the level with the shop til DL reaches 45 (which was max for a regular dungeon) and you will see.

Welcome adventurer! Deathray and
Petrification in stock today!
""#...
""#...
"@/.@.
""#...
""#...

[Doalag]

And how you know the danger level of a level? I mean before any SoD and after any SoD.

[Macros]

Danger levels of dungeons in Adom can be founded over the internet(such knowledge was aquired by code-diving though).


Imagine that Death ray is DL45. It will still have minor chances to appear on DL1 level

I'm quite sure that it's exactly different, ie. item with danger level x, have no chances to be founded on levels with danger below x value. Same goes for monsters(that's why dwarven halls are so dangerous, because monsters out of depth can be generated there).

[Doalag]

Ok thanks about the danger level, by searching internet, I found one list... in guidebook online... then checked and already had it in guidebook (non online). :D

But once you used SoD is there any way to know the danger level? Ha well ok, perhaps by looking at level of monsters generated.

[Elone]

RoDS has DL of 8, and you can find it on both D:1 and D:46 for instance. Explain that.

[Macros]

RoDS has DL of 8, and you can find it on both D:1 and D:46 for instance. Explain that.

You can't find RoDS on D:1. Btw. have you ever founded girdle of giant strength or greater titan for example on D1-10?

[Elone]

I do remember finding that, and getting PoGA on both ID:1 and D:1. Same with certain strong books. In my very last game, which I'm still playing after its NE.

[gut]

I have never found a RoDS on D:1. I do think that
the danger levels of dungeon levels, do increase as
your PC gains exp. levels. It's (relatively) easy to
test, just take your exp. level 50 PC on a stroll
through D:1, and notice the types of monsters that
are generated. Some can be extremely out of depth.

[Macros]

I do remember finding that, and getting PoGA on both ID:1 and D:1. Same with certain strong books. In my very last game, which I'm still playing after its NE.

PoGA has danger level 1, so yes, it's possible to find it on D1. But I don't believe in finding RoDS on D1(unless you've read several scrolls of danger there). That's for regular 1.1.1 version, I don't remember if Togu's patch is changing something in danger levels case.

[Doalag]

I agree, unlike what I read sometimes the danger level of a dungeon seems linked partially to character level. I have no rule, but when using pet and training them and level up very slowly, I noticed changes of monsters generated from one character level to another character level.