[Balance] Restrict stomafilla sacrifice
issueid=1382 12-06-2012 03:45 PM
Ancient Member
Number of reported issues by Grey: 57
[Balance] Restrict stomafilla sacrifice
Stop too many stomafilla herbs from being sacced

There are currently restrictions on certain sacrifices like animated trees and breeders/summons to prevent or restrict the numbers of easy sources of piety. The same should apply to stomafilla, which can be easily farmed to give large amounts of piety, even giving several easy precrowns early in the game. A god should only accept around 10 before saying "ENOUGH WITH THE HERBS, ALREADY. I WANT SOMETHING MORE MEATY!"

An alternative would be to reduce the piety gained from stomafilla to around a tenth its current value. This would still allow scumming/farming, but would make it so tedious that it would be beyond the effort of most sane players.
Issue Details
Issue Number 1382
Issue Type Feature
Project ADOM (Ancient Domains Of Mystery)
Category All
Status Implemented
Priority 8
Suggested Version ADOM 1.2.0 pre 6
Implemented Version ADOM 1.2.0 pre 6
Milestone (none)
Votes for this feature 2
Votes against this feature 2
Assigned Users (none)
Tags (none)




12-06-2012 03:48 PM
Ancient Member
Incidentally I have no problem with stomafilla proving infinite food in the game. It does so in a slightly inconvenient way (bloated status isn't good) and in the later game one can have infinite food from ratlings anyway. The game is clearly designed around having an early game food clock and a late game corruption clock, and the balance of these works quite well at the moment.

12-06-2012 04:11 PM
The Creator
Herbs no longer are accepted as long-term sacrifices.

12-06-2012 04:13 PM
Ancient Member
I'm undecided on this one. Early game, you can get more than 1 precrown if you really want to, but the second and third precrowns become really tedious. Frankly, it's already tedious enough that I never get precrowned at all, as it stands. And more than three precrowns is hardly possible unless you want to give up the pyramid for it.

Also, if you get an altar on, say, PC:5 you can do the same thing more efficiently I think?

Late game, you can gain piety much faster by casino gambling and saccing gold.

12-06-2012 04:32 PM
Ancient Member
@adom-admin: Hot sugar, that was fast! Also, it really is amazing to have you working on the game again :D I'm looking forward to all the changes this month will bring!

12-06-2012 04:57 PM
Ancient Member
Quote Originally Posted by adom-admin
Herbs no longer are accepted as long-term sacrifices.
Still doesn't completely solve the issue, as herbs can still be sold.

12-06-2012 05:04 PM
Ancient Member
Herbs aren't worth very much to sell. That's a pretty minor consideration IMHO. There's much easier ways to generate gold.

12-06-2012 05:09 PM
Ancient Member
I'm very pleased thanks guys.

12-06-2012 06:21 PM
Ancient Member
Quote Originally Posted by grobblewobble
And more than three precrowns is hardly possible unless you want to give up the pyramid for it.
Sacrifice the herbs, then get to level 17 inside the pyramid. :D

12-06-2012 06:53 PM
Ancient Member
Quote Originally Posted by Stingray1
Still doesn't completely solve the issue, as herbs can still be sold.
Also shopkeepers have gold limits, so it's all okay.

12-06-2012 07:29 PM
Ancient Member
Quote Originally Posted by Grey
Also shopkeepers have gold limits, so it's all okay.
A great improvement. Curious, I've never had Waldenbrook run out.
We all know there's a much better source of unlimited gold anyway, that only last a few game turns.
Well, and some stunning.

12-06-2012 07:33 PM
Senior Member
Quote Originally Posted by adom-admin
Herbs no longer are accepted as long-term sacrifices.
And in just 26 minutes after the suggestion. Wow. Well done.

12-07-2012 12:52 AM
Ancient Member
Quote Originally Posted by adom-admin
Herbs no longer are accepted as long-term sacrifices.
well, thats the end of multiple precrowns.

12-07-2012 01:06 AM
Ancient Member
I've gotten multiple precrowns from just live sacrifices before. Generally lawful altar in cavern, of course...

12-07-2012 05:40 AM
The Creator
Quote Originally Posted by Stingray1
Still doesn't completely solve the issue, as herbs can still be sold.
But that's a different problem. The issue was about sacrificing. Please submit a new issue.

12-07-2012 05:58 AM
Ancient Member
Quote Originally Posted by adom-admin
But that's a different problem. The issue was about sacrificing. Please submit a new issue.
I'm fine with how it is, as JellySlayer pointed out, herbs aren't worth much gold.

12-09-2012 10:20 PM
Exy Exy is offline
Junior Member
Quote Originally Posted by Carter
well, thats the end of multiple precrowns.
Yep. And there's really no other use for sacrificing stomafillia (since for a crowning or a first precrowning, it's easier just to live-sacrifice than to set up an herb farm).

So the net effect is to take out one aspect of the game, that probably only a small minority of players bothered with, that didn't unbalance the game (since precrowns are, on the whole, not a great bet -- the likelihood of getting a really useless artifact already balanced them out). It's not as though a stomafillia farm guarantees you Preserver, Protector, and Nature's Companion. I think that for the one game in a hundred that a player who bothers with that effort gets that level of reward, the other 99 games are plenty of balance.

I hope TB doesn't continue to use "game balance" as a rationale to, essentially, enforce the preferred challenge games of a small number of players. It hardly seems necessary to "balance" Adom by making it harder.

12-09-2012 10:57 PM
Ancient Member
That hour and a half I spent farming herbs for my obligatory early game crowning was always so magical to me. How will I cope now that my deity shall no longer be satisfied by weeds and grasses, and I have to sacrifice actual valuables? It will ruin the game of ADOM forever

12-09-2012 11:03 PM
Ancient Member
Quote Originally Posted by Exy
there's really no other use for sacrificing stomafillia (since for a crowning or a first precrowning, it's easier just to live-sacrifice than to set up an herb farm).
Sorry for nitpicking, but I think that setting up a herb farm often used to be easier and faster than live-saccing for crowning. The secret is that the big room is one the worst places for a herb farm - the guidebook can give you quite the wrong idea. Other levels are much easier and less work to pacify, and you only need one square of the right type. Live saccing may be faster if you find an altar on a lucky location, such as near a bee hive or on a cavernous level, but only then.

But I mostly agree with the rest of your post. If someone wants to spend an hour pressing w5,,,w5,,, to get the black tome and the scorched spear.. I don't really see the harm.

12-09-2012 11:55 PM
Ancient Member
It's not just precrowns, it's also essentially unlimited prayers for healing, power, satiation etc. Since other sources of easily abusable piety are already restricted the herbs stood out as a sore thumb in the game.

12-10-2012 12:48 AM
Ancient Member
There's still one method to get cheap huge piety without generating any artifacts. It's called cross-aligned prayer.

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