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Allow trap type selection with blessed wand of trap creation

12-20-2012 08:41 AM

Al-Khwarizmi Al-Khwarizmi is offline

Ancient Member

Number of reported issues by Al-Khwarizmi: 62

Allow trap type selection with blessed wand of trap creation

Now that traps aren't tied to a pattern, it would be interesting to be able to create a given trap

Now that trap types are no longer tied to a specific patterns of squares in dungeon maps, it would be neat if wands of trap creation gave the option of choosing a trap type. An interesting way of doing it would be:

- Blessed wand: prompts you for which type of trap you wish to create, and creates it in the direction of zapping
- Uncursed wand: creates a random trap in the direction of zapping
- Cursed wand: creates a random trap you're not aware of in a random free direction

Note that this wouldn't be overpowered, it's something that experienced players were already doing by exploiting trap patterns and creating traps in the exact points where they would get the desired result. But with this feature, instead of using a rather exploity technique to know what the PC would have no means to know, players would be able to create a given trap by using a blessed wand (which makes sense).

The prompt for trap type could either be a list: "Would you like create an (A)larm trap, a (P)it trap, ...?" or a prompt: "Create which kind of trap?", which would create a random trap on unrecognized or null input. I think the first solution is simpler, but the second would be good if the first one would generate a too long message.

Issue Details

Issue Number 1508

Issue Type Feature

Project ADOM (Ancient Domains Of Mystery)

Category All

Status Suggested

Priority 5 - Medium

Suggested Version ADOM 1.2.0 pre 8

Implemented Version (none)

Milestone (none)

Votes for this feature 31

Votes against this feature 7

Attachments 0

Assigned Users (none)

Tags (none)

02-21-2014 02:21 PM

SirTheta

Ancient Member

Aielyn's suggestion is ideal :)

02-21-2014 03:25 PM

Harkila

Junior Member

I like Aielyn's suggestion, but I'd change the options to three traps.

02-22-2014 03:16 AM

IGB

Member

How about letting the player choose from 4 options on zapping a blessed wand: Do you wish to create ma[g]ical trap, [m]echanical trap, [e]lemental trap or [r]andom trap?
Then randomly from 4 options:
magical: teleportation, corruption, alarm, vipers
mechanical: stone block, spear, arrow, pit
elemental: water, light, acid, fireball
random: like uncursed wand

02-23-2014 09:00 AM

Al-Khwarizmi Al-Khwarizmi is offline

Ancient Member

It's strange that people say this is OP when the scummy technique for choosing trap type in 1.1.1 was not generally considered OP. This provides more or less the same functionality, but without the need for questionable techniques, and the extra requirement of blessing the wand.

I do think Aileyn's suggested change is great though. Three birds with one stone: removes any possibility of OPness, adds some nice randomness, and removes the problem that displaying a message to choose among all possible trap types would be too long. I would make it three traps, though. Or alternatively, I also like IGB's variant. Any of them would be nice.

02-23-2014 02:18 PM

JellySlayer JellySlayer is offline

Ancient Member

The 1.1.1 method was not as reliable as this would be as it required knowledge of top trap for the level and require the PC to actually be in the right place in the level to take advantage of the top trap. Using a wand of trap creation as an emergency teleport was not a reliable method to get out of trouble. This is much better.

02-24-2014 05:26 AM

Stingray1

Ancient Member

It's also not how things in the game work.

Also, 1.1.1 it took the player quite a lot of games to even realize that traps types had patterns and then he/she still had to do the effort in noting them down, which I never found the patience for, hence. With this suggestion they are given the opportunity to select trap type from the first game, nauseating.

02-27-2015 07:04 AM

SinsI

Senior Member

Tried using wand of trap creation to cross a river, and after more than dozen tries still didn't get a single teleport trap, so this RFE would be very, very welcome - wands of trap creation are completely useless otherwise.

How about this: you are allowed to choose the type of trap, but it is not 100% reliable.
Blessed create it with 50% chance of being the one you selected, normal 25% chance, cursed creates completely random trap.

02-27-2015 01:25 PM

Blasphemous Blasphemous is offline

Ancient Member

Oh the wands are very useful - I frequently use them against cats.
It just takes 2-3 castings to finally get a trap that will kill the annoying cat that's following you.
They also occasionally save PC's life when you get into a closed location and run out of teleportation.
Also, once you create a trap and it's the one you needed, then even if it runs out of charges (like acid, fireball, one-timers like stone blocks) you can repeatedly recreate it on the same spot and use it in the future (like stone blocking multiple cats, my favorite).
Once a trap has been created, it becomes sort of "fixed" on that particular tile.
Alarm traps can be a blessing versus mixed vaults and cats too.
Overall I think wands of trap creation are in my top 5 most commonly used wands in the game in their current state.
I wouldn't mind making them better but frankly it's unnecessary.

02-27-2015 03:58 PM

Harwin

Ancient Member

I really like more uses for holy water, to spread out why you'd use it.
I agree that creating a TP trap on-demand would be OP.

I really like being able to pick from 2 or 3 suggestions, including with monster creation.

Voted yes assuming it's a pick from 2 or 3.

Edit: At at minimum it seems like the blessed wand should "detect" the trap it creates.

02-27-2015 09:14 PM

BenMathiesen BenMathiesen is offline

Senior Member

I also vote for Aelyn's suggestions as the most balanced and fun.

12-08-2015 09:46 AM

emilus

Junior Member

I've created similar thread not long ago. *** 3966 *** Please share your opinions and vote :)
Selecting trap type is still awesome idea.

12-08-2015 11:05 AM

JagaJazzist JagaJazzist is offline

Junior Member

Too overpowerd is "some" cases

12-08-2015 12:28 PM

emilus

Junior Member

Originally Posted by JagaJazzist

Too overpowerd is "some" cases

Please Give an example.

IMHO all wands of trap creation should start with only 1 charge that will allow only to create simple traps like:
Empty pit, stone block, water, spear, viper, arrow, light trap or random weak trap.

Dipping them with booze or reading scrool of charging should give them max +2 more charges and blessing them - possibility to select more advanced traps...

So to cast 1 powerfull trap (for example. acid,alarm,fireball,teleport,corruption) we must have blessed wand and at least 3 charges so next casting of for ex. acid trap will require dipping it in 2 potions of booze or reading 2 scrools of charging...

That IMHO will be balanced, will make trap creation more exciting and will give PC more strategic options when fighting monsters.

Somone suggested that casting more advanced trap should be possible for only PC with high disarm trap/detect trap skills and dexterity (for eg. assassins, thieves)

Making this restrictions will surely not allow this feature to be abused and will not be gamebreaking :)

12-08-2015 12:42 PM

Harwin

Ancient Member

Emilus - no wands currently use multiple charges per zap, that might be pretty confusing just to add this little bit of functionality.

Another option for blessed wands of trap creation might be to make them create *discovered* traps. So after you zap it you know what it did, and the trap won't accidentally hit you.

12-08-2015 01:05 PM

emilus

Junior Member

Originally Posted by Harwin

Emilus - no wands currently use multiple charges per zap, that might be pretty confusing just to add this little bit of functionality. [...]

You mean it will be 'confusing' like hard to implement for adom team or hard to understand for players ?

I imagine it like this:

Casting from cursed / uncursed wand or blessed wand with less than 3 charges will work as normal wand now but if PC will have some skills (high dexterity/disarm(or detect) traps) and have blessed charged (+3) wand he will be prompted which trap type he would like to cast.

I dont see how this could be confusing in any way.

12-08-2015 02:39 PM

Harwin

Ancient Member

Originally Posted by emilus

Confusing for players. It will be the only wand that takes multiple charges, and only in some cases.
Making it auto-discover created traps seems like a simple solution that gives "blessed" some utility without being confusing.

12-08-2015 02:51 PM

Al-Khwarizmi Al-Khwarizmi is offline

Ancient Member

Auto-discover created traps is an improvement but a bit lackluster, IMO. I still don't see the suggestion in the OP as OP (see what I did there?), but as most people seem to consider it OP, I think Aileyn's or IGB's suggestions are a good compromise.

12-08-2015 04:56 PM

JagaJazzist JagaJazzist is offline

Junior Member

emilus: Please Give an example.

Well you can create corruption trap and polymorph anyone(?) into WMoPH,like water dragon,and just take all stuff.You can rob shop with some fireball traps,and do another things...

12-09-2015 08:58 AM

emilus

Junior Member

Originally Posted by JagaJazzist

I thought that bosses and unique monsters for eg. water dragon and shopekeepers cannot be transformed. Try to throw at them potions of exchange if you dont believe...

How you can use WoTC in shop it is doable ? every attack on shopekeeper should make him hostile and summon thugs...

other things ? like what ? Please be more specific.

before 1.2.0 we could use top trap rule to create desired trap and nobody complained about that it was so OP.

With suggested above restrictions and limitations this feature will certainly not be OP.

12-09-2015 11:59 AM

Blasphemous Blasphemous is offline

Ancient Member

Cat lord can be polymorphed into wmopc.
Though admittedly the circumstances would have to be very special.
In my case it was a mixed tension room on top of a trap room and when shit hit the fan, kitty started meowing at monsters that activated fireball and alarm traps but his dancing around took him through a series of corruption traps and he was turned.
Fun times.
I don't think that's possible anymore but the feature is technically still out there. Extrapolating, some other unique monsters can probably be turned into wmopc as well but that's not an exploit.
I'd say it's a consequence of game mechanics and a clever way to deal with stuff. It should be rewarded rather than branded as exploit.

I can't imagine how you'd rob a shop with a fireball trap. What, you place traps on clear ground around the shopkeeper and let monsters activate it? That would take ages, not to mention you running out of monsters.
Following this line of thought, you could do a similar trick with just about anything, if you put in a tremendous amount of time but that's not really a problem is it?

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