orc bug

[Doorsfan]

It would still be a good defense mechanism if it were made more realistic. If monsters wandered about aimlessly in the dark, as makes sense for them to do, you would still be able to use darkness to get the hell out of a dangerous situation. What you wouldn't be able to do is to use it to kill an enemy that would be outrageously out of your league otherwise. Which makes perfect sense.

You can't base an interacting premis on running away! That's not interacting. That's fleeing - now you might argue for that fleeing from a mob because you are helplessly weak is a good design, but in my mind, it's just that much more fun to acctualy have a chance and not turn ADOM into a living nightmare. Hell, play as a doomed character if you're hellbent on making stuff harder for your self.

[grobblewobble]

I agree with Al-Kwharizmi, actually I think it's a great idea on how to make darkness neither overpowered nor useless.

[gut]

> Though, I do agree.. Darkness is exceptionally overpowered.

> I think monsters in dark should wonder around aimlessly

> you wouldn't be able to do is to use it to kill an enemy that
> would be outrageously out of your league

> how to make darkness neither overpowered nor useless.

All this talk about darkness being overpowered. The reason for
this is very simple: darkness was never USED by anyone, ever.
It never got tested in gameplay. It was one of those things that
flew under the radar when ADOM was being actively developed,
so never got nerfed. I'd say the same goes for invis to a certain
extent, though I don't think it was AS neglected as darkness,
I'd say it wasn't far behind.

So, the real question is who to blame for bringing the exploity
nature of darkness and invisibility to the masses? Who is
responsible for players now routinely killing ancient wyrms (!)
with exp. level 20 thieves? Who is to blame for shopkeepers (!)
dying to the melee attacks of exp. level 1 wizards (!)? Who is to
blame for the entire Water temple area being rendered null, as no
monster in there can attack in dark? Our beloved RL is a writhing
mass of brokeness now, thanks to one man. So who is to blame?
The answer is simple.

Grey.

[Al-Khwarizmi]

I laughed hard.

[The Metro Gnome]

Dude, that, was, pure, GENIUS! I lol at that one.

[Sadface]

Big monsters can still be afraid of the dark. It's that eerie feeling
that you don't know what is out there because monsters are not
omnipotent in regards to other monsters, except perhaps Andor
Drakon to all other monsters. Sure, you might be a fire giant that
can smush a human flat in a few seconds, but what if a giant-sized
WMoPC snags your leg out of nowhere, and you have no idea what
it is because you are being denied one of your senses temporarily?

However, I do find it odd that monsters simply cower in darkness,
letting you smack them around, if they did not seen you before. I
would think they would try to lash out, or flee much sooner than
they do. It somewhat makes sense that if you are already engaged
in combat with them, they have an easier time remembering where
you were because they were concentrating on you before the
darkness appeared.

[lotuskip]

The darkness in ADOM is clearly some kind of special darkness. Ever since I first encountered it I've wondered how come you can't see out of the darkness. Usually, if you stand in a dark spot and there is a lit spot right next to you, you can actually see the lit spot. But ADOM darkness fills your eyes so that you see nothing, not even that which is illuminated.

And yet you are familiar enough with your inventory to tell each item apart with perfect accuracy, even though you supposedly can't see anything. And then there's the "no shooting in the dark" rule, that made Soirana's blind monk a little bit more crippled...

All and all, I'm against realism in games. The more 'real' you try to be, the more ridiculous your failure shall turn out.

[MrNiceguy]

Big monsters can still be afraid of the dark. It's that eerie feeling
that you don't know what is out there...

Think of how the average person would feel/act if they were in a dark room with a rat running around. Most people I know would completely freak out.

It does bug me, though, that there are so many aspects of the game that work differently for the PC than for the mobs. Invisibility is probably the one that bugs me the most. If I'm invisible and I attack a monster, then that monster can now see me until I kill them. But an Ogre Magus or Invisible Stalker can smack me around as much as they want - unless I've got something that grants See Invisible, (or the Ogre's spell runs out,) I've got to guess where they are.

My own 2gp on how Invisibility should work: When attacked by an invisible monster, you have a chance to see them - odds are determined by perception score. Once spotted, the monster is visible as long as they are standing next to you. Once they move away, you lose track of where they are standing. Monsters likewise have a chance to see you once you attack, but once you move away from them, they no longer know where you are.

[gut]

I would love to see perception pumped a bit. Same
for all the 'useless' stats.

[MrNiceguy]

Yeah, I've actually spent a fair bit of time trying to come up with uses for 'useless' stats and skills. For example, Rangers are supposed to be scouts and hunters. I'd love to see a Ranger class power that allows them to detect the general location of out-of-view monsters based on the level of the Listen skill. At lower levels, you would occasionally see a generic monster character show up out of view. At higher levels, you would be more likely to hear them, and you'd have a chance of showing the actual monster instead of the generic character. After all, a good hunter would recognize its prey by sound.