Top gear

[vogonpoet]

I am pretty sure Grey ended up back in the ID to get his Troll XP. It just took him an insanely long time, stair hopping around ID50ish waiting for tension. I have tried such games, but even with cup born gnomes I run out of patience at around PC level 18 and dive die.

[Soirana]

iirc [and my memmory is quite poor] you don't always get noticed on tension on hop. So it is best to try something like reading simple book or w5. You don't want to hop away these tension rooms...

Also i think hopping after gate closure so i might go deeper...

[vogonpoet]

Yeah, I too believe spending a few turns on each level should increase number of tensions observed - I wonder if that is somehow Pe related

[Xanthine]

Your PC probably has to be paying enough attention to get messages like that, no? Pe and Listening should help with that.

(I hope nobody actually puts increases in Listening just because someone brought that up.)

[Soirana]

i always believed it was roll against listening even for deaf chars...

[Grey]

The score algorithm is very wrong in lots of areas. To summarise important points from my testing:

* 1 million xp = ~ 300k points (tested with various small amounts)
* No turns points above 80k turns
* Every 1k turns below 80k = 1 million points (tested with char on numerous turn levels - this is extremely clear)
* Saving Khelly = 1m points (untested)
* Paragon of order = 8m points (untested - assume this means platinum girdle)
* Various quests = small amount of points (tested some and they match guidebook figures exactly)
* For piety saccing 1000 gold = ~1300 points (up to a certain untested maximum that piety abusers likely received - dwarves get a bit more from their gold obviously)

The way the info in both the GB and IGB is both badly presented and outright wrong on many areas - for instance the formula suggests higher turns and lower hp are better, when it's actually the opposite, and certain things like equipment worn or possessed don't count for anything.

Ways to maximise points:
* Low turn count helps immensely. If you have any hope of winning in under 80k (not that hard) then you should seek to optimise this as much as possible.
* Experience dominates all, and is the biggest source of points for Archmages. Should be maximised with tricks for bosses, and should be sought out in extra forms (EM wish, AKW wish, shambling mounds + lightning, chaotics praying on Chaos plane). Remember that the experience gained from an individual monster type will half after every 20 kills of that type (and keep halving - so after 40 or 60 they may not be worth much any more). To weigh against turns you need to be scoring 3.5m xp every 1000 turns - not easy.
* Quests aren't worth turns at all. Highest scoring quest, rescuing Blup, must be completed within 80 turns to be profitable.
* Piety scores highly, equipment does not score at all. Sac everything valuable before you leave the chain (though items worth less than ~1000 gold aren't worth the turn spent saccing).
* If code-dived info is to be followed (and it likely shouldn't) then for every HP over 300 you get 4k points. You could maybe scum Jharod for PoUH for an additional few points. This is not turn-efficient.

[Soirana]

* 1 million xp = ~ 300k points (tested with various small amounts)

1milxp=100kill scorx4multiplier... more or less matches.

* Every 1k turns below 80k = 1 million points (tested with char on numerous turn levels - this is extremely clear)

If i stick with assassin and human i can throw away this part. And i like human assassins while i hate speedruns.

* For piety saccing 1000 gold = ~1300 points

I'd prefer not since whole point is to beat piety scumming anyway... And if i am not pressed on turns than xp becomes less problem...

the info badly presented and outright wrong on many areas

most will be tested before i start. About half hour job with Adombot.

* Experience dominates all, and is the biggest source of points for Archmages. Should be maximised with tricks for bosses, and should be sought out in extra forms (EM wish, AKW wish, shambling mounds + lightning, chaotics praying on Chaos plane). Remember that the experience gained from an individual monster type will half after every 20 kills of that type (and keep halving - so after 40 or 60 they may not be worth much any more). To weigh against turns you need to be scoring 3.5m xp every 1000 turns - not easy.

I am inclined to neglect turns. I'd estimate it being 250-300K area. I'd probably will aim for speed reduction towards endgame... Greater molochs on 10 speed and on correct side of invisibility... Of course i can hunt balors and titans instead....

* Quests aren't worth turns at all. Highest scoring quest, rescuing Blup, must be completed within 80 turns to be profitable

Since i do not aim for turns... Turnwise going to casino slot machine putting glass on spacebar and teleporting to altar is very efficient. Still no...

equipment does not score at all

Test will tell. I have not seen method you test with. As far as i know Adomboting stuff does not change it's value to start with.

If code-dived info is to be followed (and it likely shouldn't) then for every HP over 300 you get 4k points. You could maybe scum Jharod for PoUH for an additional few points. This is not turn-efficient.

All score lines in OP will be tested. Milking Jharod is not my style of thing...

[Grey]

Well just to clarify I made no testing with ADOMBot. My methods were simply using a backup L50 wizard who had already closed the gate, doing various different things before leaving the chain and noting the score each time. You can see some further details on Brinkster under the "best laid plans" thread. For instance, the same char leaving the chain naked with no items got the exact same number of points as he did when fully kitted out with TotRR, brilliant eq, and a pack full of D50 spoils.

[Soirana]

Okay, i will start soonish.

Not much testing needed I simply need healing and optionally try save puppy... for extra score.

[Soirana]

Opening round

Basic plan was visit small cave and try get to VD6 and try get to generate puppy alive. "Try get to" means no heroic actions in process.

1 kill was kobold, well was not planning ultra anyway... I managed to dodge two cats in small cane and get blanket, stair location, tower shield. Made to lv5 picked iron skin [on top of hardy and tough skin i opted to start]. Next will be long stride - overall i plan not to take very quick and greased lightning due to xp penalties. Quick maybe...

Well, dropped some crap in village and headed for puppy.
Pc1- hit lv6 taking long stride.
Pc2-found ants soonish after descending but decided to push anyway [3PV on studed leather arnour+2 from talents and+1 from starting gloves packed with some daggers ants are more or less doable]
Pc3- i hit herbs. Stop and explore since it is onlky day two. Met some pit vipers, killed them. Found stable square of pepper+stoma. Picked a bit healing power, got orcish helemet[9Pv total], lv7, milked out crude spear out of orc scorcher. Descended due to food becoming issue.

Pc4- i hit shop - gnome potions. He had 4pots of extrahealing for a very reasonable price [they stack so probably uncursed], bought two of them and sort out i have invisibility potion already.

I got spider factory and carefully lured them one by one to generate corpse for poison resistance.

pc5-use torch immediately, go back to PC4 few times. in end i found stairs down.
Pc6-just down and up again, on way out squeeze myself through werewolf summons [could have used invisbility but was afarid of cursed potion].
Back Pc2 start working on ants for acid resistance.
Get lv9- pick good shot as a talent.
After some time get acid resist, shop on rations, visit bandit village.

well, get quests get pick pockets...
BM-few wands, scolls of Id/danger... nothing usefull.
get booze of beggar - gray potion.

VD1-hit dreadful tension room -- large bats.
VD2-get stone block trap on girls head but nothing fatal.

Well, i saved carpenter without further problems. Stopped here as i ma unsure aboutthe way to pick healing. On one hand being Candle i can live with low initial ghealing and use Hotz quest to generate stethoscope.
On other i do not know how that quest would affect score. I am somewhat suspicious...

So i called it testing time. I will check:
Worn items for score
Hotz quest value
Xp value
Skills
some initial test on that line about visited places

and a char log:

Vulture St:16 Le:15 Wi:10 Dx:15 To:15 Ch:12 Ap:10 Ma:12 Pe:13 N+
DV/PV: 26/9 H: 59(59) P: 25(25) Exp: 9/13730 VD: 4 Sp: 90
Strained M: 7805

Star sign: Candle [cheap, but i had enough of style last game]

Daggers & knives 5 +4 +2 +1 skilled 97
Swords 2 +2 +0 +0 basic 40
Pole arms 4 +4 +1 +3 skilled 76
Thrown daggers 5 +10 +7 +1 skilled 46
Shields 4 +8 skilled 47

Right hand: +16 bonus to hit, 1d8+6 damage

Ammunition: 6?, base range: 4, +20 bonus to hit, 1d4+14 damage

 Alchemy .................. 41 (fair) [+1d5]
 Alertness ................ 60 (good) [+2d4]
 Archery .................. 40 (fair) [+3d3]
 Backstabbing ............. 68 (good) [+3d5]
 Bridge building .......... 17 (mediocre) [+3d5] (ma)
 Climbing ................. 35 (fair) [+4d5]
 Detect traps ............. 17 (mediocre) [+4d5]
 Dodge .................... 66 (good) [+2d4]
 Find weakness ............ 61 (good) [+3d4]
 First aid ................ 28 (mediocre) [+3d4]
 Food preservation ........ 63 (good) [+2d4]
 Haggling ................. 29 (mediocre) [+3d4]
 Listening ................ 56 (good) [+3d5]
 Literacy ................. 24 (mediocre) [+3d5]
 Pick locks ............... 33 (fair) [+4d5]
 Pick pockets ............. 1 (poor) [+4d5][need to increase on next level up]
 Stealth .................. 43 (fair) [+4d4]
 Swimming ................. 29 (mediocre) [+3d4]
 Two weapon combat ........ 20 (mediocre) [+4d4]


Head : rusty orcish helmet [+1, +2] {Pe-2} [100s]
Neck : pearl necklace  [2s]
Body : studded leather armor (-1, +0) [-1, +3] [250s]
Girdle : -
Cloak : hooded cloak [+1, +0]  [40s]
Right Hand : orcish spear (+1, 1d8+2) [75s]
Left Hand : large shield (-1) [+5, +1] [120s]
Right Ring : -
Left Ring : -
Bracers : -
Gauntlets : gloves [+0, +1]  [6s]
Boots : -
Missile weapon: -
Missiles : heap of 6 daggers (+0, 1d4) [60s]
Tool : torch (3352 turns of fuel remaining) [10s]



Armor ('[')
 leather armor  [150s]
Shields ('[')
 medium shield  [100s]
 medium shield  [100s]
Boots ('[')
 leather boots  [25s]
One-handed weapons ('(')
 dagger (+0, 1d4)  [10s]
 dagger (+0, 1d4+1)  [10s]
 dagger (+0, 1d4+2)  [10s]
 crude knife  [10s]
 crude knife  [10s]
 crude knife  [10s]
 club  [30s]
 hatchet  [50s]
Missile weapons ('}')
 short bow  [20s]
 sling  [3s]
Missiles ('/')
 bundle of 5 arrows  [10s]
 bundle of 2 arrows  [4s]
 arrow  [2s]
 rock  [5s]
 rock  [5s]
 bundle of 2 arrows  [4s]
 arrow  [2s]
 arrow  [2s]
 arrow  [2s]
 arrow  [2s]
 arrow  [2s]
 heap of 9 rocks  [45s]
Tools (']')
 torch  [10s]
 box with flint and steel (45)  [5s]
 tinderbox (10)  [3s]
 blanket  [10s]
 wooden stick  [30s]
Instruments ('{')
 tamborine  [5s]
Wands ('\')
 wand of knocking (7 charges)  [3s]
 wand of magic missiles (7 charges)  [3s]
 wand of light (2 charges)  [4s]
 wand of far slaying (8 charges)  [3s]
Potions ('!')
 heap of 2 potions of poison  [8s]
 potion of invisibility  [4s]
 potion of healing  [4s]
 heap of 2 potions of extra healing  [4s]
 heap of 2 potions of water  [8s]
 potion of healing  [4s]
 gray potion  [4s]
 potion of potential charisma  [4s]
 potion of water  [4s]
 oil of rust removal  [2s]
Scrolls ('?')
 scroll labeled "ABABILA"  [2s]
 scroll labeled "mead ni najap"  [2s]
Books ('"')
 manual of bridge building  [100s]
Food ('%')
 heap of 3 strange herbs  [6s]
 heap of 4 strange herbs  [8s]
 heap of 3 stomafillia herbs  [6s]
 heap of 13 pepper petals  [26s]
 heap of 5 strange herbs  [10s]
 loaf of bread  [40s]
 heap of 4 bones  [16s]
 piece of dry meat  [15s]
 hurthling cake  [30s]
 hyena corpse  [120s]
 bit of candy  [2s]
 giant rat corpse  [60s]
 goblin rockthrower corpse  [60s]
 lizard man corpse  [120s]
Valuables ('$')
 1487 gold pieces  [14s]


222 monsters perished under her attacks.


She survived for 0 years, 7 days, 5 hours, 15 minutes and 42 seconds (7805
turns).
Vulture visited 17 places.
Her strength score was modified by +3 during her career.
Her willpower score was modified by -2 during her career.
Her dexterity score was modified by +1 during her career.
Her charisma score was modified by +1 during her career.