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Thread: Guidebook work

  1. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by gut View Post
    Coin throw attack start out with a range
    of only 3, but at exp. level 10, it increases to 5, and increases further
    with continued increases in exp. levels. I don't remember the exact
    levels, sorry.
    IIRC range increases by 2 every 10 levels.

  2. #72
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    I don't think there's a reason to worry, Soirana. I think Andy is the last person anyone should suspect of being liable to adapt other people's works without consent.

    If you're likely to become angry at the fact that the regular old Guidebook is going to be updated, and are unwilling to contribute to the accuracy of these additions, you might be happier not reading this thread at all.

    (Incidentally, Guidebook link updated. Oops.)

  3. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by Silfir View Post
    I don't think there's a reason to worry, Soirana. I think Andy is the last person anyone should suspect of being liable to adapt other people's works without consent.

    If you're likely to become angry at the fact that the regular old Guidebook is going to be updated, and are unwilling to contribute to the accuracy of these additions, you might be happier not reading this thread at all.

    (Incidentally, Guidebook link updated. Oops.)
    Don't feed the troll.

  4. #74
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    > It clearly contains doubtfull info...

    Maybe point out the doubtful info. Maybe point
    to some tests that disprove it. Help make the
    GB better.

    > if uyou include DL for dungeons why not include for items?

    No idea on that one, but maybe that info was
    submitted forever ago, and was submitted as
    not having been code dived. It seems the whole
    roguelike community is somewhat on the honor
    system in most of what they do. If someone
    submitted the data as having been gathered
    legitimately, then maybe it should be viewed
    under the best possible light.

    > This sort of hipocracy is beyound my understanding.

    Maybe not hipocracy, but just the difference
    between properly documented info, as opposed
    to improperly documented info. I share your
    oppinion that the dungeon level DL info is
    code dived, but I wouldn't call anybody
    names over it. It's just a game after all.

    > main problem in my opinion was not lack of info but
    > some basic mistakes... This seems to be getting even worse...

    I'm pretty sure that the gorgon corpse stuff
    was not incorperated in the GB : ) I'm pretty
    sure that somewhere amongst the mass of info
    I typed out, there were plenty of mistake fixes.
    If you feel like I'm posting inacuracies, then
    point to them.

    > The only not code dived info on that known for
    > me [and keep in mind without published details]
    > is mine research.

    I'm going by this post by Grey, and I remembered
    reading this in his 'treasure hunter' post on rgra.

    http://www.adom.de/forums/showthread...pse+generation

    >> I don't know of any exact quantisation of the skill's
    >> effects, but when I was researching the effects of TH
    >> I looked a little at the skill and found that the
    >> difference between 50 and 60 skill level actually had
    >> a big effect on corpse generation. I think you just
    >> got incredibly unlucky - it happens sometimes.

    > exactly one of cases of that i would like not being included

    But since it's not code-dived, then shouldn't it be OK?

    > Leave me away from this enertainment, okay?

    I did test the water breathing thing before posting.
    I was recieving ~350 damage with each case of being
    'washed away' while I had no water breathing source.
    I donned a few water breathing sources and never
    took 200 damage. Yes, it was a brief test, and so
    could be coincidence, but I have memories of testing
    this in the past to the same conclusion.

    > Wah, Gut! So much doubleposted information >_<

    I can't help the 10,000 character limit.

    > IIRC range increases by 2 every 10 levels.

    IIRC you are exactly right, but I'm only 99% sure : )

    > Don't feed the troll.

    Soirana is not a troll. In fact he has a good point
    about increased accuracy over increased data. I
    really should take time to verify the stuff I'm
    posting. I just only have so much time for this, and
    I'm already going over it.
    "Whip me!" pleads the adom player. The rng replies... "No."

  5. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by gut View Post
    Soirana is not a troll. In fact he has a good point
    about increased accuracy over increased data. I
    really should take time to verify the stuff I'm
    posting. I just only have so much time for this, and
    I'm already going over it.
    "I've deleted the GB bookmark"... "I'm going to delete my posts about game mechanics"... He's trying to make it sound like the GB won't ever be successful without him, and makes it clear that he doesn't care two hoots about the target audience. Of course, that's unnecessary, as we may already know he never wanted to help newbs, but it really sounds like the guidebook was ought to be made for *him*, the renowned ADOM veteran. Yeah, that's why I probably replied with that one line - I'm sick of how Soirana is thinking of introducing the "sarcastic veteran"-archetype* into these forums, which IMO really is unnecessary in every forum, especially in one which doesn't have such a big active community as some of today's games.

    *If you don't know, for some reason, what I'm talking about, GameFAQs tends to have crateloads of these on the most popular multiplayer or multiplayer centric games' message boards, esp. MMORPGs. And that is one of the forumer types I'd place under the category "troll".

  6. #76
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    Please don't compare anyone on these forums to the twats on GameFAQs, least of all Soirana. I will remind you that he has published tonnes of testing and game info on here for the benefit of all, and written by far the best Tower guide to date. He may be terse sometimes, but don't go presuming nonsense about him because you don't like his attitude. He is extremely correct in that we shouldn't be shoving random rumours into the Guidebook - there's enough of those as is. Nothing should go in without proper testing.

    With regards to the DL identifications, it's obviously code-dived stuff, but it was from before the "ban". There has never been any call to purge the Guidebook of this sort of info after the fact, and generally TB's call to stop code-diving was directed at any further work (which was rapidly leading towards a complete decompilation of the code - something Vladimir said he would have been quite able to do had he had the mind). Use of ADOMBot for testing is a bit sketchy. My main worry would be about reliability of information - a lot of ADOMBot changes produce unreliable results. I'd be happier with an in-game archmage.
    Platinum Edition ADOMer
    http://gamesofgrey.com - check out my roguelikes!

  7. #77
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    My definition of 'troll' is making posts just to try
    to get a reaction. Soirana's writing style often
    ends with phrases like 'goes to sob in corner', or
    'goes to bang head on a wall'. That's just his
    writing style.
    "Whip me!" pleads the adom player. The rng replies... "No."

  8. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by gut View Post
    Maybe point out the doubtful info. Maybe point
    to some tests that disprove it. Help make the
    GB better.
    Maybe not. I'd rather call myself troll.


    Quote Originally Posted by gut View Post
    gorgon...
    If you feel like I'm posting inacuracies...
    water breathing...
    You taking way to personally. Saying about "gut's hallucinations" was just regular teasing we do on each other...

    If you want on posted inacuraccies overall...
    There was a guy posting about oil of rust removal and rust monsters.... Well, i would not call the result as nothing.... Leaving aside my impression of nerfed to hit and crits [never quantified], I never got any item rusting after using oil to *weaken* rust monster.
    even after dooming char seriously.... Given fact how PoCC removes corrupting hits i'd say it is as certain as i can detect.

    Well, again i do not keep track of things *community* knows. For me it is old known fact.

    re: water breath - i do recall checking only single source of resistance...

    Quote Originally Posted by gut View Post
    But since it's not code-dived, then shouldn't it be OK?
    IIRC, taking serious parts of Guidebook [well, IGB case and later requests] is considered not being okay... Why taking info inside guidebook should be okay if person clearly states he does not want this to happen?




    Quote Originally Posted by Maul View Post
    "I've deleted the GB bookmark"... "I'm going to delete my posts about game mechanics"...
    Was actually reffering to infamous "black post" on brinkster... As my attitude goes at least i did not called anyone lazy morrons this time....

    Quote Originally Posted by Maul View Post
    really sounds like the guidebook was ought to be made for *him*, the renowned ADOM veteran.
    Actually i do have something which used to be guidebook which was compiled with IGB info+houland + anything i know on my hard drive. I use that for my personal needs and check "guidebook" only when i need quote something.


    Quote Originally Posted by Grey View Post
    it's obviously code-dived stuff, but it was from before the "ban".
    It is very messy topic. I do know a lot of pre"ban" info which never made to "accepted knowledge". Well, again from what i've heard on IRC most people use IGB on regular basis.

    Quote Originally Posted by Grey View Post
    ADOMBot changes produce unreliable results. I'd be happier with an in-game archmage.
    Overall merging files in tmpdat folder is actually more reliable if you ask my opinion, just Bot is faster...

    Ages ago i proposed giving save for anyone wanting to do some tests. never met a volunteer...

    That proposal still stands. It is not botted char... Just resave from kill max EG challenge... has over 50 wishes and shitload of exchange pots in case you need more....

    Quote Originally Posted by gut View Post
    My definition of 'troll' is making posts just to try
    to get a reaction.
    Quote Originally Posted by gut View Post
    Soirana is not a troll
    I do troll in meaning i post in specific manner to get reaction sometimes... Ain't gonna stop anytime soon.

    Overall it would be niceif you focus on topic instead of me...
    So far rolled 15 casters with RoDS and shamelessly killed them within 200 turns. For eternium glory!
    (after 15 I stopped counting...)

  9. #79
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    This is more of questioning an entry, but, under Oracle corpse effects,
    it states that you'll get +6 LE and about +4 MA from it, but I only got
    +3 LE from it. 23 - 26. My potential LE is about 35 - did I do something
    wrong?

  10. #80
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    Like many stat increases from corpses, it depends on the current value. Up to about 20 it's guaranteed, and above 30 it gets increasingly unlikely. The +6 simply means six attempts at increasing the stat. They can all fail or all succeed or anything in between.

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