[1.2 Prelrease 5] - Candle born Dwarven Weaponsmith ULE

[Harwin]

First win as a weaponsmith - also the first time I've actually smithed anything ever (my other weaponsmiths always died too early - Candle was just so helpful here, especially before the nerf)

The good:
0) Randomly finding an AoLS... I wasn't planning on getting a ULE - I just wanted a weaponsmith win.
1) Darkforge had a (+18, 6d5+18) 2H eternium sword - with the massive DV from smithing I did a lot of berserk melee with it. The ACW went down incredibly quickly.
2) Which was perfect for later using the Axe of the Minotaur Emperor(got lucky and didn't waste too much time on false levels). The Earth Temple was no issue.
3) Got "Lust for Glory" from a vault - first artifact I've seen that wasn't in 1.1.1 (even though I know it's technically not new)
4) Scorched Spear + Nature's Companion and weaponsmith class power let me pick =Acid from crowning, completing my immunities.
5) Sun's Messenger found in a random vault let me finish out my artifact set.
6) Water dragon cave gave me a wand of wishing (1 charge)
7) Moloch armor + weaponsmith gave me crazy armor. Had 89 DV while fighting Andor Drakon, and that was with Nature's companion instead of eternium plate.

The bad:
1) While trying to change my alignment to C for the ratling, I was digging graves in the Dwarven Graveyard. Worked for a while but an emperor lich drained a lot of stats before I fled. I did at least come back and 1-shot him with Sun's Messenger.
2) Was somewhat careless with Minotaur Mages, pointlessly lost stats there too (and no PoGAs from maze) (question at end)
3) *Almost* forgot to finally kill Keriax before diving to UD:50
4) Keriax's corpse provided almost no stat boosts (question at end)

The ugly:
1) First time I've ever had to do the ACW with out intrisinc fire resistance, and only 3 sources (RotHK, ring of -Fire, and elemental gauntlets)
2) Mace of disruption lying on D:19. CoC graveyard was D:18.
3) Potion of Uselessness lived up to it's name - Got "Perion's Mithril Platemail" - worse than my smithed armor, and provided resistances for which I had intrinsic immunity.
4) Forgot to bring stomacemptia to D:50 - wasted some boosts letting everything drain down.

5) And the ugliest....
Got the Courage quest, check my notes - first kill "Giant Bat" - I had killed 4. No problem, I'll have 24 by the time I'm ready to do this. Killed 24, turned it in, stopped killing them. Went on Filk quest, got to ID:24. No filk. Uhoh.... Thought about every monster that I could possibly have killed first, and for which I had killed at least 21 during the game. Mmm.. I hope I just wrote down "Giant Bat" instead of "Large Bat" by mistake - that's level 39... And that it's not Skeleton - 172.... Or Assassin... 57, which had just gone way up before getting the quest - would serve me right for killing them all after taking the quest.
Went down, zapping a wand of monster detect on those levels that seemed likely to have a value that matched - missed a few (forgot about goblin slavemaster - 30), but thankfully there he was on 39...


Thanks to everyone with the help on getting XP. I ended up leaving half the molochs alive - no reason to tempt fate and mess something up. Poor barbarian - I trashed his home. Maybe he should learn something about courage.


And now: Three questions:
1) Stat drains - do they only occur in melee? I think I've only noticed them in melee...
2) Does Keriax's corpse provide St bonuses only if your potential is high enough?
3) I often see other people, even in prerelease 14, after fixes to ring of weakness, disease, etc, with significant lifetime stat increases - note that my Strength and Toughness gains here included the class-based ones. Am I missing something? I couldn't get the dwarven trainer to raise anything above about 20, even with fairly large payments - although I only made so many attempts - I wasn't trying to scum his training.

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Harwin        St:55  Le:29  Wi:62  Dx:54  To:54  Ch:22  Ap:18  Ma:53  Pe:22 L+
DV/PV: 65/89   H: 923(923)    P: 0(968)      Exp: 50/37050470   ChAoS Sp: 428
Blessed Invisible Satiated Berserk
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----------------------------------------------------------------------------
                                  Inventory
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Total weight: 5366 stones                Carrying capacity: 12375 stones

He: uncursed eternium cap (+2, +2) [+6, +10]                          [28s]
Ne: uncursed rustproof amulet of free action {iron}                    [3s]
Bo: uncursed fine leather armor (named) (+2, +0) [+2, +8] (+15 spd)  [120s]
Gi: uncursed eternium girdle [+8, +8]                                 [12s]
Cl: uncursed cloak of invisibility (-1, +0) [+6, +9]                  [30s]
RH: blessed Trident of the Red Rooster (+36, 6d12+18) [+12, +12] {Ma+24} {iron}
LH: -
RR: uncursed ring of mental stability [+2, +1] {Le+3} {iron}           [1s]
LR: uncursed ring of the master cat [+0, +5] {Dx+16} (+16 spd) {adamantium}
Br: uncursed bracers of speed [+6, +4] (+4 spd) {iron}                [10s]
Ga: uncursed elemental gauntlets (-1, +0) [+0, +3] {iron}             [10s]
Bo: uncursed eternium boots [+7, +10]                                 [55s]
MW: -
Mi: blessed potion of cure corruption                                  [2s]
Tl: -


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                                    Stuff
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Total weight: 4944 stones   Carrying capacity: 12375 stones

Armor ('[')
   uncursed white eternium plate mail of protection (-1, -2) [+6, +17]
Shields ('[')
   uncursed small black shield "Lust for Glory" (+1) [+5, +5] {Wi+3} {iron}


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                                Weapon Skills
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Melee weapon           Lvl   Hit   Dam   DV   Level          Required marks
---------------------  ---   ---   ---   --   -------------  --------------
Pole arms               12   +14    +8  +16   Mastery              2201
Twohanded weapons       13   +16   +21   +5   Mastery              5344

Missile weapon         Lvl   Hit   Dam   Ra   Level          Required marks
---------------------  ---   ---   ---   --   -------------  --------------
Bows                    10   +20   +15   +3   excellent            679
Crossbows                8   +16   +12   +2   excellent            224

Shields                Lvl   DV               Level          Required marks
---------------------  ---   ---              -------------  --------------
Shields                 10   +20              excellent            1531


Damage caused with your melee weapons:
--------------------------------------
Right hand: +250 bonus to hit, 6d12+86 damage


Damage caused with your missile weapons:
----------------------------------------
Ammunition: 1, base range: 2, +74 bonus to hit, 1d2+20 damage




---
                                   Spells
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   Acid Ball        :     9,  66pp     (Effectivity: +0)
   Acid Bolt        :    35,  24pp     (Effectivity: +0)
   Bless            :     9,  15pp     (Effectivity: +0)
   Burning Hands    :    82,   9pp     (Effectivity: +0)
   Cure Light Wounds:   178,   5pp     (Effectivity: +0)
   Darkness         :   313,   4pp     (Effectivity: +2)
   Destroy Undead   :     9,  15pp     (Effectivity: +0)
   Disarm Trap      :    34,  16pp     (Effectivity: +0)
   Earthquake       :    11, 151pp     (Effectivity: +0)
   Fire Bolt        :     8,  19pp     (Effectivity: +0)
   Frost Bolt       :   291,  12pp     (Effectivity: +0)
   Identify         :   101,  75pp     (Effectivity: +1)
   Improved Fireball:    11,  56pp     (Effectivity: +0)
   Invisibility     :    24,  17pp     (Effectivity: +0)
   Knock            :    36,  19pp     (Effectivity: +0)
   Know Alignment   :   168,  10pp     (Effectivity: +0)
   Light            :   222,   3pp     (Effectivity: +2)
   Lightning Bolt   :    11,  22pp     (Effectivity: +0)
   Magic Lock       :   374,   8pp     (Effectivity: +0)
   Magic Map        :    57,  57pp     (Effectivity: +1)
   Magic Missile    :    43,  12pp     (Effectivity: +3)
   Mystic Shovel    :   135, 100pp     (Effectivity: +0)
   Petrification    :    12, 225pp     (Effectivity: +0)
   Remove Curse     :    93,  53pp     (Effectivity: +0)
   Scare Monster    :   101,  12pp     (Effectivity: +0)
   Slow Poison      :    34,   9pp     (Effectivity: +0)
   Strength of Atlas:     3,  19pp     (Effectivity: +0)
   Teleportation    :   158,  21pp     (Effectivity: +6)


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              His achievements during his adventures:
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Harwin, the dwarven weaponsmith, transformed into an avatar of Order.
He scored 12017578 points and advanced to level 50.
He survived for 0 years, 95 days, 1 hour, 22 minutes and 17 seconds (134991
turns).
Harwin visited 151 places.
His strength score was modified by +19 during his career.
His learning score was modified by +16 during his career.
His willpower score was modified by +16 during his career.
His dexterity score was modified by +18 during his career.
His toughness score was modified by +29 during his career.
His charisma score was modified by +13 during his career.
His appearance score was modified by +8 during his career.
His mana score was modified by +13 during his career.
His perception score was modified by +9 during his career.
He was the champion of the arena.
He was a member of the thieves guild.
He made a little water dragon very happy.
He killed the emperor of the ancient minotaur race.
He defeated the arch enemy of a mighty karmic wyrm.
He adhered to the principles of the Cat Lord and thus rose to great fame.
He saved Khelavaster from certain death.
He ended his adventuring life in the palace of Andor Drakon.
5783 monsters perished under his attacks.
The following 38 artifacts were generated during his adventure:
  the si
  the scythe of corruption "Moon Sickle"
  the ring of the master cat
  the golden gladius "Death's Sting"
  the dwarven shield "Rolf's Saviour"
  the elven long bow "Sun's Messenger"
  the Chaos Orb of Elemental Water
  the Chaos Orb of Elemental Air
  the Chaos Orb of Elemental Fire
  the Chaos Orb of Elemental Earth
  the staff of the Wanderer
  the rune-covered long sword "Trusted One"
  the lead-filled mace "Big Punch"
  the scorched spear
  the gauntlets of eternal peace "Shezestriakis"
  the rune-covered trident
  the sword of Nonnak
  the elemental gauntlets
  the ring of the High Kings
  the phial of Caladriel
  the crown of science
  the ancient mummy wrapping
  the ankh
  the hammer of the gods
  Perion's mithril plate mail
  the intricate wooden shield "Nature's Friend"
  the small black shield "Lust for Glory"
  the Crown of Chaos
  the Medal of Chaos
  the rune-covered club "Skullcrusher"
  the Chaos Orb of Elemental Mana
  the black rune-covered dagger "Needle"
  the black rune-covered dagger "Sting"
  the fine leather armor "Nature's Companion"
  the Trident of the Red Rooster
  the weird tome
  the rune-covered halberd "Wyrmlance"  <--- never found this.
  the axe of the minotaur emperor
He possessed the following intrinsics:
  He was fire resistant (also through an item).
  He was poison resistant.
  He was cold resistant (also through an item).
  He was lucky.
  Fate smiled upon him (also through an item).
  He was able to control teleportation.
  He was invisible (gained through an item).
  He was paralyzation resistant (gained through an item).
  He was resistant to death rays (gained through an item).
  He was shock resistant (also through an item).
  He was able to see invisible things (gained through items).
  He was immune to shock attacks (gained through items).
  He was immune to fire attacks.
  He was immune to acidic attacks.
  He was immune to ice attacks (gained through an item).
  He was able to breathe water (gained through an item).
  He was able to resist confusion attacks (gained through an item).
He had the following talents: Affinity with Polearms, Affinity with Swords,
Affinity with Twohanded Weapons, Alert, Basher, Careful, Defensive Fighter,
Good Shot, Greased Lightning, Long Stride, Melee Weapon Master, Mighty
Strike, Miser, Powerful Strike, Quick, Strong of Will, Treasure Hunter, Very
Quick.
He had a final speed score of 428 (final base speed: 129).
He was a messiah of Morodwyn.
He asked for 5 divine interventions.
He was a holy champion of Order.

The following monsters were vanquished:
      1 ElDeR cHaOs GoD
      1 emperor lich       <--- I said I'd be back.
      4 farmers             <--- If you'd had the decency to drop a corpse, I wouldn't have to murder your friends.
     21 greater molochs <--- thanks everyone!
     26 giant bats         <--- careful when taking notes
     41 large bats

[anon123]

Congratulations on winning Please know the version you are playing is mostly devoid of balance changes. It's on pr7 that potentials were made hard limits and Candle gives 1 HP every 20 turns (which is still pretty good for Chaos Knights, for example, as they heal really slowly otherwise), as part of a massive amount of so-called rebalancing.

1) Stat drains - do they only occur in melee? I think I've only noticed them in melee...

Yes, stat drains of both kinds (hits from wights, shadows and such, and the spell) can only occur if you're in melee range.

2) Does Keriax's corpse provide St bonuses only if your potential is high enough?

Wel, in pr5 you can still use starvation and sickness to get a higher increase (or one at all), which will increase the potential if it has to. Be aware that Keriax's corpse grants a massive amount of corruption.

3) I often see other people, even in prerelease 14, after fixes to ring of weakness, disease, etc, with significant lifetime stat increases - note that my Strength and Toughness gains here included the class-based ones. Am I missing something?

Gardening received a strong buff, so it's easier to create herbs and pump stats to their potential limits. Drop rates were also slightly increased to balance for scumming nerfs, which might result in additional potions of gain attributes and -stat-. Pick Pockets' success rate was frustratingly reduced, but if you remain persistent you can get a few potions that way too.

One of the most important changes was the buff to the Minotaur Maze. The emperor now drops a bunch of PoGAs and a random artifact, which might provide an additional stat boost. That place is definitely worth the hassle now. Combined with the other pile of potions you get from killing the greater white unicorn, that results in a massive increase to all attributes once you can deal with both challenges.

4) Scorched Spear + Nature's Companion and weaponsmith class power let me pick =Acid from crowning, completing my immunities.

I always wondered whether it's possible to have a PC who has all resistances and immunities in the game intrinsically. I guess that a level 32+ natural enemy of undead Weaponsmith who gets insanely lucky with pools could do it?

[Harwin]

Wel, in pr5 you can still use starvation and sickness to get a higher increase (or one at all), which will increase the potential if it has to. Be aware that Keriax's corpse grants a massive amount of corruption.

Assuming I don't want to use starvation and/or sickness (which I've never liked doing)... I assumed that "orb guardian" corpses didn't care what my existing stat level was. I had I think 38 natural strength when I ate him, I expected to go to 48.
So it will raise my potential, but like giant corpses, it has a cap on what it will raise my stat to?

Yeah the corruption killed my UGC wizard... I didn't account for the 20% bonus corruption, but in this case I ate Keriax right before I finished the white unicorn quest.

[gym21]

Regarding the stats question -- I've been playing p14 and my stat gaining hasn't been too difficult. I use Garth, harvest morgia and moss when possible, run the minotaur maze and tend to hang out in the big room for a while longer than most, so these sorts of numbers aren't entirely unusual (for a character with maxed-out athletics):

His strength score was modified by +24 during his career.
His learning score was modified by +18 during his career.
His willpower score was modified by +29 during his career.
His dexterity score was modified by +21 during his career.
His toughness score was modified by +23 during his career.
His charisma score was modified by +15 during his career.
His appearance score was modified by +20 during his career.
His mana score was modified by +10 during his career.
His perception score was modified by +10 during his career.

One thing that's probably a bug I find very useful at the moment: If you have a boosted statistic, drinking a potion of potential [stat] raises your potential to your current (boosted) stat plus one. This is incredibly useful for herb and corpse training, and I think it also comes into play in the late game, where having very high potentials increases your chance of stat increases on level up.

[Harwin]

Regarding the stats question -- I've been playing p14 and my stat gaining hasn't been too difficult. I use Garth, harvest morgia and moss when possible, run the minotaur maze and tend to hang out in the big room for a while longer than most, so these sorts of numbers aren't entirely unusual (for a character with maxed-out athletics):

How high does Garth get you? I've never been able to get him to help me past 20 - and on this game he wouldn't even help my Str past 19...

[grobblewobble]

Assuming I don't want to use starvation and/or sickness (which I've never liked doing)... I assumed that "orb guardian" corpses didn't care what my existing stat level was.

IIRC this is true for orb guardians (it is definitely true for the Minotaur Emperor corpse), but not for Keriax. Which is in fact weird; given how badly his corpse corrupts, it would be fair if the stat increases would be unconditional.

Don't know about Garth, personally I never train with him. You need extreme amounts of money to get any stat increases beyond 20. If I have that much money I would rather convert it to piety.

[Harwin]

IIRC this is true for orb guardians (it is definitely true for the Minotaur Emperor corpse), but not for Keriax. Which is in fact weird; given how badly his corpse corrupts, it would be fair if the stat increases would be unconditional.

Don't know about Garth, personally I never train with him. You need extreme amounts of money to get any stat increases beyond 20. If I have that much money I would rather convert it to piety.

Something I should RFE? Or Bug?

[gym21]

How high does Garth get you? I've never been able to get him to help me past 20 - and on this game he wouldn't even help my Str past 19...

He can take you past 20, but you probably have better things to spend money on at that point. Personally I use him to get the bulk of my stats (L especially) up to 20.

[Stingray1]

Something I should RFE? Or Bug?

What puzzles me is that corpses don't raise potentials, but Garth does.

This is contradictory with the manual and/or Thrundarr's information, IIRC. Surely gains from corpses are magical and Garth's training is not?

[gym21]

What puzzles me is that corpses don't raise potentials, but Garth does.

Some corpses do, some don't, right? Dark orcs and butchers seem to raise strength past potentials; kobold shamans mana gains always seem to work.