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Thread: More Wish advice

  1. #1
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    Default More Wish advice

    Yeah I've read through a coupleof the other threads, wishes are just one of those things you don't want to feel you wasted.

    Status of current character -- level 20 Orc Paladin, going for first Ultra (haven't decided L+ or N=)

    Khelly saved (AoLS dropped by random monster before D:8, where the first altar was generated and I was able to ID a bunch of stuff.)
    Mystic gave me SoCR so I have 9 now. 2 corruptions (TP and regeneration, so not bad ones)

    Water temple down with little issue, Didn't save the corpse due to being a moron and not immediately blessing the corpse. Though I tried to cook it with all my wands of fire and failed. But I have one blessed PoCC from Keethrax and one uncursed found randomly (for Gaab'Bay).

    - Have scroll of danger for Gaab'bay.
    - Need boar skull, but it's already past 90 days, so I can scum for this. Have a ring of doom to make it go a little quicker.
    - RotHK acquired
    - Using Big Punch as weapon. Swap to Nonnak if planning on heavy casting (Snake was magic missiled to death with an awesome 9 effectivity MM). 2nd best melee weapon is lawful mithril scimitar, which is solid against chaotics, but kinda measly against Neutrals or lawfuls.
    - No intrinsic FR yet. Rest of ToEF set is pretty set. RotHK + Elemental Gaunts + intrinsic FR for resist. Ring of ice + blessed fireproof already acquired through helpful RNG. Best armor in Darkforge was eternium ring mail [0,9]. I use AMW most of the time for SeeInvis and other benefits (like the low weight given I'm using Big Punch), however will likely use the eternium for ToEF. Mithril chain mail of speed is another option [-2,+7], but it's even heavier.

    - Sitting on 3 blessed PoGA for use after casino pays for some extra stats, also one potion of Strength. Potentially casino will get Le to 20-22ish though $$$ for Garth, but that's slow work. Nothing but potions will get my mana stat up, right? Considering PoEx for stat swaps. Currently at:
    25 St / 17 Le / 25 Wi / 25 De / 26 To / 16 Ch / 11 Ap / 15 Ma / 25 Pe
    Assuming I can get Le to 20ish from Garth, that leaves only 3 that could be dangerous to swap with STR. Ending up with 11 perception would suck too, but paying to get that ~18 isn't horrible. I'm leaning towards using one on PoEx.

    Would like to get Learning and Mana up for some casting options after Rift, I think PoEx has the potential largest gains there, It's somewhat risky, but with my current stats seems like risk is low and fairly recoverable. The stats that can't be Garth trained are already quite poor, so it can't get much worse. Others are all correctible in time if I don't end up with low numbers on the easy to herb buff up Wi / De / To.

    Used one already on seven league boots. Got 4 pair. Willing to sacrifice one or two in ToEF:4 to ease that a bit, though they might not burn to a blessed ring of ice, I'm willing to let them for the movement advantage.

    So my current list for my remaining four wishes is:
    - save 1 for "just in case" for SoCR or other need not apparent at this time
    - Eternium tower shield (right now using medium crystal [9,7], which is somewhat heavy, but not too bad. Crystal is good and [9,7] is decent enough at this stage in the game. I think I can live without an eternium tower until the RNG decides I'm worthy. )
    - Ancient Red Dragons -- hoping for corpses. no Food Pres may make it backfire. also I'm not 100% sure I could handle that at level 20, though with Wyrmlance and Polearms at 9 I should be able to, as long as I don't get breathed to death with only 2 resistance items.
    - Alternate method of handling ToEF: Kill the Druid for Shield of Raw Steel and wish for SoCR to make up for the lost PoCC and extra corruption of the shield using it in the tower. Also gives an artifact I don't mind feeding to the ratling. Difficulty is that I don't know how to kill the druid without making the whole town angry at me, which would be a problem when Khelly shows up.
    - Alternate method 2 of handling ToEF, Scum floors 1 & 2 for corpses in an indestructible set. Fire Giant Kings could be a problem, but should be rare on 1 & 2. I'd bring rocks for missiles and use in a set like that, But I think I'd be over 30PV, should be okay.
    - GoGS, but I know I will carry too much then get it destroyed from a random acid vortex or something, I'm skeptical here
    - Ring of Weakness, but I don't want to be too scummy. Plus I don't have too many reliable methods of removing curse. I suppose the library will have at least one copy of that book.
    - Bracers of Resistance, probably higher up than GoGS, but has the same issue, I've had 3 sets of bracers destroyed already, how long would these really last?
    - PoEx -- Would likely be able to significantly improve my casting potential by bringing mana and Learning to 25, may potentially kill my STR though, and with Big Punch my only available weapon doing more than 12 damage to neutral or lawful beings, that could potentially hurt a lot.
    - Food Preservation. It's still early enough to raise this.
    - Alchemy. will be a chore to raise with low learning and already Level 20, but I have enough time left for it to be useful
    - Find Weakness - Character is an Orc, she already has this.
    - Archery - I like throwing rocks and pew-pew with bows is pretty overpowered when you have blessed SLB... as long as you ammo lasts.

    What are your opinions.
    I think at this point I'm leaning PoEx + Food Pres or Archery + Something for ToEF for Fire resist, RDSM or one of the listed options for intrinsic fire resist + save one for rainy day.
    Last edited by Concillian; 06-24-2009 at 04:44 AM.

  2. #2
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    About stats:

    1) Eat the oracle and then use an altar
    2) Mana is extremely easy to raise by, say, bookcasting (in the wilderness while hunting boars if you'd like)
    3) Would not use PoEX with stats this balanced

    This kind of eliminates the need for using casino gold, as you don't want to scum too much anyway. Basically after raising mana a bit, I would feel free to use the potions.

    About wishes:
    You seem to be having issues with weight. It seems logical that books of lordly might would be useful and would also help raise mana. Wishing for dragons is kind of a waste (you will only get one and the drop rate on corpses will be quite low). RDSM, food pres, or tower eternium shields would all be good wishes in your position, I think.

    Hope that helps.

  3. #3
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    Definitely don't use a PoEx - completely unnecessary. Garth training isn't needed either. Go eat the oracle, get undoomed, drink all your PoGA and you'll have fine stats. Ma will get trained over time, and isn't that important anyway.

    I'd go the route of scumming the first couple of levels of the tower for a corpse - fire drakes usually provide easily enough.

    As for wishes:
    - bracers of resistance are nice, and can be handy for Air Temple and BDC too (where they won't be destroyed)
    - GoGS after the Tower if you feel you need it. Only really handy if you melee mostly.
    - Spellbooks of whatever. Forst bolt and invis are handy in the tower, acid ball is great for most of the game. Remember to use the clerical names when wishing.
    - Save one or two if you feel the need. You'll likely be fine for SoCRs if you're going for a ULE, but even so you don't want to end up short (especially since it's after day 90 already). A wish for speed against Andy can be nice too. However you should still remember that you may well find more wishes later, and you're best using the resources you have now to make sure you survive now. You'll kick yourself if you die with unused wishes in your pack.
    Platinum Edition ADOMer
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  4. #4
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    killing druid:
    Stun ray will turn him hostile without problems. As long as he is hostile and not panicking when killed village won't care.

    Red dragons can be encountered in widlerness. With day over 90 this is not problem. I think they appear primary in mountains, so as long as your climbing set is not cursed you should hunt them down...

    GoGS - rather ring of weakness...

    bracers of resistance - once rustproof these are next to indestructable [just keep away from eyes of destruction and anihilators...]

    PoEX not unless you want try getting more wishes. Just sell some si's [if you have dwarf in HMW also it might end black market being best if proper race is generated] and feed gold to Garth, top with Oracle.
    Mana should go easily while bookcasting in wilderness while hunting for dragons.

    Skills... Rather go for scrolls of education and later [after stats and skills are fixed] with writing sets?

    Other suggestions:
    Demon slaying ammo? all orb guardians, Andy, emeperor moloch is counted as demons, iiirc.
    AoLS for personal use.
    So far rolled 15 casters with RoDS and shamelessly killed them within 200 turns. For eternium glory!
    (after 15 I stopped counting...)

  5. #5
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    Considering your stats, I don't see any reason to bother using the PoEX to rearrange things. Like mike says, eating the oracle gives Le +6, and Mana can be raised by casting a lot of spells. Nothing is really that low except appearance and charisma, which you don't care about, so I don't think it's really worth it. I normally use my PoGA before the ToEF, but I rarely get stats from Garth beyond the early game. Beyond that point your stats are usually good enough that an extra point here or there won't matter all that much.

    I wouldn't bother wishing for dragons in hopes of getting fire resist. If you're worried about it, you can use one wish on RDSM. A ring of elemental mastery isn't a terrible choice either, since you get three immunities out of it instead of just the one.

    If you dip random bracers into your PoEX, there's a fairly high probability (like 1 in 6 or something) of getting bracers of resistance. I'm not sure if they're fireproof. I would guess they probably are. I wouldn't wish for these, myself.

    Food preservation is always a good choice. It isn't quite as useful now since you probably have most of the intrinsics you need, but there's always rare corpses like giant slugs and black unicorns to hunt for later on. Archery isn't a bad choice, although I'm not sure it's wishworthy.

    If you have the right spells, wishing for an ancient karmic wyrm is a good choice. If you kill it while it is invisible, and you are slowed, you will gain ~8 million experience. This should level you into the mid-thirties. Make sure you have invisible on before you summon. The extra levels should make most of the remainder of the game a bit of a pushover. You can wish for the emperor moloch too, although that is quite a bit riskier in my mind.

    It won't help you with the tower, but GoGS aren't bad for boosting your St. Then again, once you finish, you can just use the fire orb for the +10 St, so that might solve your burden problems for quite a while.

    If you're feeling lucky, you can wish for scrolls of education, and then magical writing sets. Write a bunch of scrolls and hope you get lucky and get Alertness, Archery, etc. Not sure this is worth two wishes though. If you've already seen a scroll of education, might be worth considering.

    [edit]Books of priestly acid balls are also a great choice. Ball spells are super rare for priests, so having a big stock of a powerful spell would probably be pretty nice to have.
    Last edited by JellySlayer; 06-24-2009 at 06:07 AM.
    Hoping to win with every class, doomed. Archer, Barbarian, Bard, Beastfighter, Druid, Elementalist, Farmer, Fighter, Monk, and ULE Priest down.

  6. #6
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    You have wyrmlance and should have atleast one Pocc. So, wake wyrm, throw a potion of blindness/confusion/invis, throw the pocc and bash him to death with wyrmlance. Very simple, very safe and very easy.

    If you have enough castings on MM, train it up to, say 25, and the wyrm will be no problem. Getting from 9 to 25 takes 279 castings. Other possibility is to get ice bolt, slow monster, crown of science and means of invis, since the rooms filled with elementals will give you atleast 3 levels and that will help a lot. All the stuff will be useless later, making the wish(es) somewhat shortsighted.

    MM on the other hand is the best spell after teleport(IMHO), best offensive spell against bosses(!) and wishing for spellbooks of mm is actually something to consider. The reasons MM kicks ass: nothing is immune to MM, only higher golems(including steel) are almost certain to shrug the bolt *too* many times, its *very* cheap on pp, only 4 when trained somewhat and it bounces. The last will make it a sure fire against any enemy, since all the nasty one-hit-kills are fired in a straight line, plus with some planning you can make 2 hits with one bolt.

    I'm pretty sure the oracle can only raise Learning to 24 or 25 so starvation training is in order if boost of six is wanted. Starvation/sickness training will also get your strength to 30(with sickness) and to 50 with starvation and atleast 60 with both since giant corpses can train str to 24, therefore Ring of Weakness is not a good choise IMHO. Food preservation is pretty great talent in my opinion and I wish it over slb if playing wizards, but it will definetly not help you right now.

    By the way, the black unicorn gives 3 to 9 poga and 6-7 is very common. For ultra ending the white unicorns lame reward should be forgotten alltogether.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by johonka View Post
    The reasons MM kicks ass: nothing is immune to MM, only higher golems(including steel) are almost certain to shrug the bolt *too* many times, its *very* cheap on pp, only 4 when trained somewhat and it bounces. The last will make it a sure fire against any enemy, since all the nasty one-hit-kills are fired in a straight line, plus with some planning you can make 2 hits with one bolt.
    And another important reason: it's the only bolt that never destroys items on the ground. And a less important, but also relevant one: if your character is not excellent at Le, MM is easier to learn than other bolts (and than other damage spells, perhaps excepting burning hands) and you'll probably get more castings from the books.

    I'm also a fan of MM, it's up there with burning hands, teleport and strength of atlas on my list of favourite spells.
    Last edited by Al-Khwarizmi; 06-24-2009 at 01:22 PM.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by johonka View Post
    MM on the other hand is the best spell after teleport(IMHO), best offensive spell against bosses(!) and wishing for spellbooks of mm is actually something to consider.
    Well I have 2 spellbooks in the OC and I assume Rift will have at least one. So I should have quite a few casts. I haven't been reading books a ton because I've been getting some really poor readings, like increasing only 30 casting points on a read. I was looking to push my learning up a bit more before any serious reading. I'll need to read some more of this before ToEF though.

    I was planning on clearing out the Rift monsters, then having a nice sit down with the books after donning the Crown of Science and my +4 Le Ring of Mental Stability. Up until recently most of my reading was done at Le = 19 (15 base + 4 from ring) but Garth has me at 19 base now. I'm assuming the Le+9 makes up for the cursing and dooming on the crown? I don't really know.

    I just ran around the tower a while looking for a corpse. Finally got one in mixed fire being tension room on TF:4 (mostly beetles but a couple Elementals and a Red Dragon. It took a while, with several trips in and out and a lot of spenseweed. I think there were 8 Fire Giant Kings when I checked monster memory on the one I had to kill going back out. That one double crit me down to 18. Thank you Khelly for the spellbook, I TP'ed out to the stairs to find it was surrounded by a grue, dragon normal Fire giant and a worm. TP'ed again to a nearby hall and spensed back to full health.

    I also replenished my stoma supply so I can get doom / curse removed from eating the Oracle. In the process of that i've been using Phial to use PP and Mana has only gone to 16 so far.

    So when I'm ready for major spellbook reading, I'll probably wish for Acid Ball / Rain of Sorrow books. I should be okay on MM, but may use a wish there.Otherwise, I think I'll just sit on them for a while.

    Tower scumming also yielded gauntlets of STR and a fire giant corpse that gave +1 STR. My equipment was barebones and I lost nothing. I'll go back in for the Wyrm soon.

    Thanks for the advice
    Last edited by Concillian; 06-25-2009 at 01:53 AM.

  9. #9

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    Spellbooks of Veil of God might be a solid choice depending on whether you have other permanent invisibility sources...

    Use Garth to get Le to 18-19 and then eat the oracle while sick/starved. PoEX are unnecessary.
    ________
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    Last edited by sterjs; 02-24-2011 at 11:03 PM.

  10. #10
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    If you already have two books of magic missile, it seems a bit wasteful to me to wish for any more. Acid Ball would be a much better investment--magic missile isn't that uncommon anyway, you'll probably find others in the Rift or elsewhere.

    Crown of science will definitely improve the number of casting you get. Being doomed does double the background corruption rate though, so keep that in mind if you do some reading in the Rift. You should be getting some SoCR there anyway though, so that will more than compensate for it.

    I think you mentioned you had a ring of ice. If so (especially if you have Fate Smiles), then with it blessed, there's no reason to go with barebones equipment in the ToEF, really. You might lose the odd thing here and there (equipped bows and cloaks still tend to be pretty vulnerable, for example), but you probably won't see much equipment damage otherwise. I've sent characters in with no blanket or ring of ice, but with Lucky + Fate, and had very little appreciable equipment damage.
    Hoping to win with every class, doomed. Archer, Barbarian, Bard, Beastfighter, Druid, Elementalist, Farmer, Fighter, Monk, and ULE Priest down.

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