Save me from myself.

[melphen]

I have already applied the information on blink dogs with success. Thanks for the advice, that worked really well and didn't take too long at all once I found one. Oddly on the next level I opened a door to a room of blink dogs and could have feasted on those puppies. There is no telling how many of those things I killed to get through to the next room.

[JellySlayer]

That's an interesting stat. I tend to agree that Candle isn't a significant advantage, but it depends on your play style. If you play more casually, Candle is great for healing nice and fast and continue on with your game.

Also I wanted to agree above that Dwarf Pally is great for early survival, but they top off quickly for damage and overall effectiveness in the mid/late game. I can't really suggest a specific class, typically any race/combo with find weakness. I would caution towards Trolls and Orcs, or any race that can die easily of unnatural aging. Maybe go with a Dark Elf?

If you get crowned with Justifier, paladins are pretty much unstoppable. Otherwise, paladins are no worse than a lot of other classes as far as melee damage goes. Get them a decent slaying weapon or Big Punch and they'll be fine in the endgame. They also make passable casters and find lots of spellbooks, so you can use some magic missiles in a pinch.

No live for drakelings in this thread? Acid spit, nice starting skills and stats. If you take something like a paladin, you'll have good gear too, actually. Plus you basically get a free pass to finish the ToEF without difficulty. No ice queen area though.

[Blasphemous]

I always take gray elves.
Though I wouldn't say they are easy, once you get used to low strength, toughness and hp, they're pretty awesome otherwise.
Always high learning guarantees literacy and 4-5 skill increases per level.
Coupled with high mana it also makes learning and casting spells easier for classes that rely on melee.
Finally gray elves have the second longest livespan of all races, reason I don't play orcs or drakes anymore.
My most recent gray elven thief found herself inside a huge tension room of ghost kings deep in CoC.
Since they spotted me and they pass through walls, I had no choice but to destroy them all.
I was aged more than 500 years, something that non-elven races would not have survived.
My gray elf was middle-aged, that doesn't happen too often.

[LexyBoy]

I'd say there's something in picking a r/c combo which is fairly weak at the beginning but strong in the midgame. I started playing ~15 years ago, with all the time in the world, and never got close to winning - probably around ToEF was the farthest I got without savescumming (which totally kills the game BTW). After a hiatus, started playing again around a year ago and have since won 4 times - despite only having time to play a few hours a week.

Thus I think playing less can help - you become more attached to characters you've known for a month than those you only started yesterday, and you have time to think of your strategy (and how you could have avoided deaths) between plays. And take your time in the game too - though you might feel panic on seeing a dangerous monster, the game cares not if you spend 10 minutes looking through your inventory (or spoiling yourself on the wiki, though this does take some of the fun out). It's almost always easier to escape a situation than fight your way out.

[gut]

> I can't seem to get to a place where herbs are really useful for me.

well, there's your problem. Herbs are the single scummiest scum in a world of scums.
A noob trying to beat adom without properly using herbs is like attacking yourself with a bag of hammers. Yeah, it may be fun, but you'll just wind up hurt in the end.

[yhal003]

> I can't seem to get to a place where herbs are really useful for me.

well, there's your problem. Herbs are the single scummiest scum in a world of scums.
A noob trying to beat adom without properly using herbs is like attacking yourself with a bag of hammers. Yeah, it may be fun, but you'll just wind up hurt in the end.

Herbs are somewhat less important in 1.2.0 without stomafillia precrownings and not being able to push stats past potentials. Characters with attribute potential of 25 tend to have high attributes anyway.

[melphen]

If herbs are scum give me another way to deal with all the stat draining things in the game please. Its really easy to end up with stats drained to the point where things get real silly. I have to say I don't understand nerfing herbs in this game with everything else already lined up against you. It was something that used well balanced the game a little from what I could see. It requred both knowlege and skill to use correctly so taking it away at all seems odd to me.

This is one of the things that frustrates me with this game. A new version comes out, fixes some problems and makes the game harder. It seems every time there is a new release something gets toned down a little. I understand that the better players want more challenge, but those of us still trying to get to the end for the first time need something too. There are more non-players than expert players so why make this game so much more challenging to get into? I don't get much time to keep up with what is coming for ADOM, but with Steam coming up it would seem like we want new players. I understand that version looks to have some features that make the game something entirely different IMO but it still isn't doing much for someone like me, someone with a real interest in the RL part of this game.

Thanks for the help guys. Things have taken a sudden turn in my personal life and ADOM has been a great escape for a little while these last few days.

[mjkittredge]

Melphen, I think TB has a tough job of making the game accessible to new players but at the same time limiting the game breaking exploits and scumming experienced players use which can trivialize the content and diminish their experiences.

Herbs are still very very useful, get dex and toughness and willpower to 25, heal yourself, cure disease and poison, most satiating/low weight food in the game. And get some free piety from saccing stomafilia, so it was a compromise, instead of taking it completely away from unlimited piety. Also keep in mind, If those stats get lowered beneath 25 you can use herbs to raise them back up to that again.

[yhal003]

This is one of the things that frustrates me with this game. A new version comes out, fixes some problems and makes the game harder. It seems every time there is a new release something gets toned down a little. I understand that the better players want more challenge, but those of us still trying to get to the end for the first time need something too. There are more non-players than expert players so why make this game so much more challenging to get into? I don't get much time to keep up with what is coming for ADOM, but with Steam coming up it would seem like we want new players. I understand that version looks to have some features that make the game something entirely different IMO but it still isn't doing much for someone like me, someone with a real interest in the RL part of this game.

I would say that new versions are actually easier. There is new 3 level introduction dungeon for weak characters, new ice giant dungeon to prepare before ToEF, guarantied GVs. Guarantied ice wand and ring of ice make certain locations doable. There is significantly less corruption on lower levels. New corruptions make it easier to cherry pick benign ones. Early rivers are rare, so there is smaller chance of getting stuck in UD or on the way to dwarftown. All in all this is more than enough to compensate for herbs and scumming.

Herbs are still useful but no longer essential. Yes, their use requires some skill and resources either to pacify the big room or holy water to grow gardens elsewhere, but gathering herbs once the garden is grown is boring and repetitive. I used to always go for one precrowning in the past, but now do it only when conditions are right (altar on cavernous level, cooking and hurthlings, few treasure vaults etc.).

[grobblewobble]

Eating morgia roots until your toughness reaches its potential maximum still works and really helps.

In addition, carrying a bunch of herbs to cure both sickness and poison is worth it. Very lightweight and it can save your life.

A pile of spenseweeds is also great to have, this can make difficult places much easier.

A pile of stomafillia solves your food problems once and for all. Cooked lizards can do that too, but stoma weighs less.