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Thread: IGB update

  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.PelicanPants View Post
    i guess copyright's a deep discussion but i did lose respect for it after pharmaceutical companies sued african people for copying HIV medicine in multiple situations. for trying to stay alive? it's like telling your starving neighbor "i know you want to eat to live and all but that's not just any apple, that's a special jumbo red delicious i grew, so you need to pay up." they cared more about their share of the money and their exact pill version
    Pharmacy is a business not a charity. Developing the 'pill' typically costs millions of dollars.

    Like it or not in modern world medicine is developed primary by business, which is likely on the oil business level of profitability. B ut you can also evaluate point that, if medicine was primary developed by charities/government the mentioned pill would not exist at all. (If you think opposite, please list few modern medications invented by non-business model).

    GB vs IGB is actually quite a lot of same. Decade ago GB was not abandonware (for record it is not copyrighted anymore). AW put in lots of time in sorting through guidebook improvement submissions/reports (some of them were pick pocket dragon/shake tree type) and actually checking stuff (submitting testable saves w as frequent request).

    And.. Pavel kicks in copying GB (links and mentions about original appeared later on, I think under influence of Darren) and adding mostly code driven data (without any testing, backthoughts, etc) despite for everyone clearly understanding TB position on that.
    You can call rgra/AW overreacting (copyrighting GB certainly was), but I think general direction was more than right.
    So far rolled 15 casters with RoDS and shamelessly killed them within 200 turns. For eternium glory!
    (after 15 I stopped counting...)

  2. #32
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    Just to be clear, I make no profit from the ads. It's the web hosting provider, who decided to put ads there. Might change the provider, but low priority for me, as people are not complaining, except the few notorious IGB-haters here. And it would mean all users need to change their links.

    However this is exactly I did not want to start. Curse on you, Soirana, can't you just grow up? AW finally decided that the GB is public domain, and I congratulate him on that decision. Although it should have been that way from the start in the first place. Nowadays with AWGB public domain, and TB apparently not caring about code diving anymore, there is really no reason to think that IGB is 'illegal'.

    I welcome comments on the IGB itself, to improve it further, and not discussion about whether or not it is allowed to exist, because that is pointless now, like it have been similarly pointless 12 years ago.

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by IGB View Post
    and TB apparently not caring about code diving anymore, there is really no reason to think that IGB is 'illegal'.
    Recent citation needed.
    So far rolled 15 casters with RoDS and shamelessly killed them within 200 turns. For eternium glory!
    (after 15 I stopped counting...)

  4. #34

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    it might not matter if source of research is business funded or govt funded as long as people want it and are working for it? i believe in capitalist aspect too (and that it works best for a lot of things, currently) but in life/death cases like copying a medicineee i just believe in no limitations to access no matter what (can't let copyright get in the way imo).
    and some people apply that 'can't let copyright get in way of progress' to everything or at least a lot more things than life/death situations. and that's okayyy it doesn't mean they're a troll.
    i agree some things are probably done out of spite but i don't blame him for feeling that way... ppl just attacked him instead of trying to explain their side

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Soirana View Post
    Recent citation needed.
    You know, I'm not really for or against anyone here in this whole thing but I just want to point out this applies to you as well. If TB says he doesn't care one way or the other (though personally i suspect he probably does care) this whole thing you've caused will look a bit silly.

  6. #36

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    anyway speaking of IGB maybe a shortcut section or some kind of most used 'go-to' links for people used to the game and checking up random things. or at least a link to the stat training page somewhere would be neat because i can't seem to find it half the time

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.PelicanPants View Post
    it might not matter if source of research is business funded or govt funded as long as people want it and are working for it? i believe in capitalist aspect too (and that it works best for a lot of things, currently) but in life/death cases like copying a medicineee i just believe in no limitations to access no matter what (can't let copyright get in the way imo).
    Was the medicine really coppied by people dying from stuff themselves? I highly doubt so, since producing it requires factory, storing, etc. So it is done by people who want to make profit without funding research (they surely can claim other desires as pirating sites do, but most likely it ends being money).

    Source of funding matters cause... if it's funded by government, general purpose is benefit for people, progress, etc. (repay comes in form of getting more votes in the election, I guess)... if it's funded by business, repay is money. If the cash stops comming, research eventually stops.

    It's not like copyright is ideal solution in theory (neither is capitalism/democracy etc - their have their own flaws), it just happens to be best working solution from what humanity tried so far. In your imaginary world were copying medicine was free, business would not fund research (and clinical tests business is actually paying to make sure drugs are safe) since there was no repay. Once again what efficient drugs were discovered by government/non-profits.

    You know, I'm not really for or against anyone here in this whole thing but I just want to point out this applies to you as well. If TB says he doesn't care one way or the other (though personally i suspect he probably does care) this whole thing you've caused will look a bit silly.
    The last time I've read his opinion (quite some time ago) he was caring. I don't know any indication about things being opposite.
    Last edited by Soirana; 09-18-2016 at 08:00 AM.
    So far rolled 15 casters with RoDS and shamelessly killed them within 200 turns. For eternium glory!
    (after 15 I stopped counting...)

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.PelicanPants View Post
    anyway speaking of IGB maybe a shortcut section or some kind of most used 'go-to' links for people used to the game and checking up random things. or at least a link to the stat training page somewhere would be neat because i can't seem to find it half the time
    Might be a good idea. Can you point out to more parts that are important to you? Because from my POV, every part is almost equally important and is linked for TOC and from the top of every page.

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by IGB View Post
    I'm using the Wiki as primary source of information - apart from in-game testing, but the information provided here if often vague or simply missing. Unfortunately there seems to be no other source for ADOM R+.
    Quote Originally Posted by IGB View Post
    Nowadays with AWGB public domain, and TB apparently not caring about code diving anymore, there is really no reason to think that IGB is 'illegal'.
    http://www.wikia.com/Licensing
    Except where otherwise specified, the text on Wikia communities (known as "wikias") is licensed under the Creative Commons Attribution-Share Alike License 3.0 (Unported) (CC-BY-SA).
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Creative_Commons_license
    Attribution (BY) Licensees may copy, distribute, display and perform the work and make derivative works and remixes based on it only if they give the author or licensor the credits (attribution) in the manner specified by these.


    Tsk tsk.
    I like my women like my ADOM loot - hunted as treasure and in extra quantity.

  10. #40

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    "imaginary world where copying is free" is putting (dumb) words in my mouth lol, please don't

    in either situation money would go to research whether it's from business profits or taxes (govt funded research isn't repay it's prepay), and both are completely possible. yeah they decided to go against copyright and 'funding further research' in that instance... to save lives in their community, and i'm glad they did.
    we don't need to rely on makers of pepto bismol or something to fund stomach research, that's going to happen anyway. they don't have to fund research. we just need to pay for the labor, storage, and supplies needed to make it after the fact. at least i'd much prefer not to rely on raising the price of a certain medicine to fund research for its cure, and i think a lot of shkreli haters would agree...

    either way these 'research income preferences' are completely besides the point now? right? the point is people get helped in the end from the whole supply/demand chain either way

    promise i won't say anything else offtopic :>

    IGB: using AW stuff is and was fine way back then too since credited but yeah stuff from the wiki should be credited too wherever applicable/possible. otherwise people really are being too silly about... having anything against all this.

    in the IGB is the stuff about stat raising still accurate? with garth raising max stats, or is that not possible now? i'm not sure if it's necessary to include the older outdated information there, and with corpse effects not always giving the stat bonuses since stat caps it would be nice to have clarification on this type of stuff. I admit I haven't read the entire guidebook since 1.2 update but i notice some and i'm glad it's there, especially the rest of the info about new classes/races

    the "4.3.5 Ultra endings step by step" could be updated to let people know when they can switch away from C alignment?

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