Lich:
> archer had to wish for an amulet of light in the Mana Temple, and
> then there's my character who had to wish for wands of door creation
It's hard to believe that no wands of door creation were generated in
a whole ADOM game. Call me a skeptic, but I think that's just too
improbable. As for no amulet of light before the Mana Temple, I don't
believe that either. I will not mention non-wish (and guaranteed)
related ways of generating those items, because it bothers Silfir : )
I would say it is possible, that the players made a mistake at some
point, and got their equipment roasted. In such a case, TH wouldn't
have helped in the slightest. Four wands of door creation can be
melted as easily as one.
> complain about having too many potions of booze, holy water, or
> scrolls of identify
Do you see?! It is this notion, that 'items are hard to come by', that
causes me to constantly refer to other (scummy) methods of generating
items. My dear Lich, all the items you shall ever desire, are right
before you. You need no talent to provide them. If you need them, *get*
them, in the most effective way possible. If you don't, then don't bother
with them, talent-wise or other-wise.
Moloch
> I'll agree that "The 'treasure hunter' is unneeded", not that it sucks
But I'm trying to prove that it sucks : )
Silfir:
> Is that improvement worth three talents, considering that the other
> effects are largely useless?
If your skills are such, that you consider an extra starting +9 speed,
or 'immune to pain' useless, then yes.
> I don't WANT to restrict myself to guaranteed items
You keep saying 'I'. The TH talent may be more useful to you than most.
I say repeatedly that if one is uber-skilled, and hates scumming, then
TH is a feature of convenience. That doesn't keep the talent from
sucking though, as there are few players in that catagory. I honestly
put it in the same catagory as 'strong legs'.
Let me approach this from a different angle. Go to the HoF, and choose
a random (winner's) flg. Scroll down to the equipment list, not the worn
items, but the 'stuff'. I put forth the idea that 95% of this is junk.
The game could have been completed *just* as easily, without all of these
(sometimes) 10,000's of stones of junk. That's what I'm thinking when
I'm saying 'unneeded items', that you won't notice much difference at
any point in the game, if you don't have all that useless stuff.
If the junk was needed, it wouldn't have been there, it would have been
used. The fact that it is left over, rather proves it's uselessness.
Some items like -death amulets are understandable, because they are
sometimes needed (and here is where I won't mention *other* ways of
getting those specific benefits). Most of the stuff is worthless, and
just serves to weigh one down. I think 'more items' does not = great, or
even good, over 90% of the time it just = more bloat.
Of course, one never knows what is needed, and what isn't, but 'being
prepared' doesn't account for (almost) universal inventory bloat. I
have noticed in our shared games, having to constantly drop heaps of
worthless items (heap of 2 grizzly bear corpses!). Getting more items
is just redundancy most of the time, and when it's not, the gains are
mostly marginal. If you hit the AoLS grand prize, then congrats.
"Whip me!" pleads the adom player. The rng replies... "No."