changed requirements for Platinum girdle?
issueid=1113 07-03-2012 08:32 PM
Ancient Member
Number of reported issues by grobblewobble: 70
changed requirements for Platinum girdle?

Very few people have managed to obtain the Platinum girdle. The main reason is that it requires that you never let a good NPC die, so if a blink dog on the other side of the level dies your attempt is ruined. This seems a bit unfair. At the same time, you can ignore lawful quests just fine and even robbing shops is ok, if you use one of the more sophisticated methods. Imho it would be more interesting to have somewhat different requirements, maybe something in the spirit of the suggestion made in this old post:

Quote Originally Posted by Covenant View Post
Back to the original topic (though I know it was slightly dead), I really think the Platinum Girdle restrictions were just too excessive to make it a fun, or even reasonable, challenge. Things like, no backstabbing, no attacking non-hostiles, etc, would be fine - but 'No lawfuls must die' is ridiculous. When you get ambushed by Blink Dogs on a corridor of one of the early dungeons, there's not much you can do.

A moot point, of course, given that development on ADOM is dead, but here are some alternative platinum girdle restrictions I would have preferred:

- No eating chaotic/undead/chaos corpses (so no snacking on goblins or orcs!)
- No attacking non-hostiles (only the 'Are you sure you want to attack y/n?' ones, though).
- No attacking monsters while invisible.
- No pickpocketing (period).
- No robbing stores/the Water Dragon.
- No accepting the Kranach reward (i.e, leave the gold on the ground).
- All Chaos Corpses (they'd be guaranteed to be generated) must be taken to the Druid in Terinyo.
- Holy Water must be poured on Grif's grave, either instead of or after he's killed in melee, but before leaving the level after killing the necromancer. If you follow me.
- No ratling/Gaab'Bay quests.
- No gambling in the Casino.
- All lawful quests must be completed (i.e, Thrundarr's, Water Dragon, White Unicorn, Rynt/Guth'Alak, Kranach AND Puppy quest (a pain in the ass, believe me, I have to do both every time because of my OCD)) excluding the 'Kill Hotzenplotz' one (alternatively, make Hotzenplotz hostile if bandit town is visited after receiving this quest).
- No grave digging.
- 90 day time limit - it's unlawful to allow the background Chaos corruption to proceed to such a high degree.

Also:
+ It's permitted to attack hostiles of any alignment.
+ No penalties for friendly/otherwise creatures dying.

Would have made an Ultra platinum ending impossible, but it'd still be fun, at least.
Issue Details
Issue Number 1113
Issue Type Feature
Project ADOM (Ancient Domains Of Mystery)
Category Unknown
Status Implemented
Priority 8
Suggested Version Unknown
Implemented Version ADOM 1.2.0 pre 7
Milestone (none)
Votes for this feature 1
Votes against this feature 1
Assigned Users (none)
Tags (none)




07-03-2012 09:21 PM
Ancient Member
I'd by happy if the only change was the first last one: No penalties for friendly/lawful creatures dying as long as they aren't killed by the PC. What's described here strikes me as one of these "too many rules" type challenges. The platinum challenge is difficult, but simple: Your alignment may never move toward chaotic, and no lawful creatures may die.

(I think that some of the "sophisticated" methods of robbing shops without alignment hits should probably just be changed... but that's discussion for another thread)

07-04-2012 11:48 AM
Ancient Member
Quote Originally Posted by JellySlayer
I'd by happy if the only change was the first last one: No penalties for friendly/lawful creatures dying as long as they aren't killed by the PC. What's described here strikes me as one of these "too many rules" type challenges. The platinum challenge is difficult, but simple: Your alignment may never move toward chaotic, and no lawful creatures may die.

(I think that some of the "sophisticated" methods of robbing shops without alignment hits should probably just be changed... but that's discussion for another thread)
Fully agree with this.

07-04-2012 04:11 PM
Ancient Member
I agree that adding all the extra rules proposed by Covenant would make it far too complicated. However, I wonder if simply dropping the "no lawfuls may die" without adding any new constraint would perhaps be too easy? In that case the only remaining rule would be "don't commit any chaotic acts". Killing lawful monsters and attacking friendly monsters are chaotic acts, so that is not a new rule.

Adding one extra requirement to replace the old one would still be ok, imo. Maybe "none of your pets may die" (prevents the easiest workaround for getting a blink dog corpse), or maybe require certain lawful quests to be fulfilled?

edit: If eating the corpse of a lawful monster would become a chaotic act, no other rule would be needed. ;)

12-11-2012 10:58 AM
The Creator
Now only PC kills count.

12-11-2012 11:32 AM
Ancient Member
This is a shame to see change, as it will just lead to players abusing the rule and using dirty tricks to kill lawfuls (pets, alarm traps, etc). To see the platinum girdle becoming about dirty tricks is... well, wrong. Personally I don't get what was wrong with it being exclusive and rare before, considering the high reward.

12-11-2012 03:19 PM
Ancient Member
"High reward"? You only get the platinum girdle on D:50, by which time you've already completed 99% of the game.

12-11-2012 03:21 PM
Ancient Member
Yeah, but it's an awesome girdle :P Also there's a huge score bonus.

12-11-2012 03:41 PM
Ancient Member
I regret this post too, Grey. Sorry. :/

12-11-2012 09:38 PM
Ancient Member
On the other hand, if a dwarf dies to an acid trap in D:4, you no longer have to play the entire game to find out.

12-11-2012 09:53 PM
Ancient Member
Do you think this would make the Ultra more possible, because I've seen my PC's alighnment drop from NC to CN upon receiving the Medal of Chaos? So, I think her quests might be chaotic actions.

edit amulet -> medal

12-11-2012 10:46 PM
Ancient Member
Platinum ultra has been done before though the solution was... very creative.

12-12-2012 05:32 AM
Ancient Member
Quote Originally Posted by JellySlayer
Platinum ultra has been done before though the solution was... very creative.
I was considering some solutions, but when I saw the alighnment change I stopped, but it might still be that it doesn't disqualify the PC.

12-12-2012 05:59 AM
Ancient Member
IIRC, you have to start chaotic and get the Medal of Chaos after the Platinum Girdle by luring Gaab'Baay to D:48. But then you might not be able to wear it...

12-12-2012 06:16 AM
Ancient Member
It would have been extremely disappointing if after such a long and arduous game, the farmer doesn't drop a corpse. Well, if that was your strategy in acquiring a corpse.

edit - I take it you wouldn't have only brought one!!

12-12-2012 08:39 AM
Senior Member
Quote Originally Posted by Grey
This is a shame to see change, as it will just lead to players abusing the rule and using dirty tricks to kill lawfuls (pets, alarm traps, etc). To see the platinum girdle becoming about dirty tricks is... well, wrong. Personally I don't get what was wrong with it being exclusive and rare before, considering the high reward.
So maybe then, it'd be a good idea to have it so that kills by pet should count, as well as trap kills: when the monster is in visual range of the PC and always when the trap was created by the PC (along with whatever is needed so that a kill from alarmed monsters follows the same rules as a direct trap kill). I think that'd take care of the abuse. Some finer-"tuning" like this could be used to achieve the desired effect: harder, but fairer.

12-12-2012 09:12 AM
Member
Quote Originally Posted by mike3
it'd be a good idea to have it so that kills by pet should count, as well as trap kills: when the monster is in visual range of the PC and always when the trap was created by the PC
I would simplify it to count just PC kills, pet kills and PC-created traps. And then I would apply the same rules for Cat Ring, buffing it up a little.

12-12-2012 11:22 AM
The Creator
Quote Originally Posted by Grey
This is a shame to see change, as it will just lead to players abusing the rule and using dirty tricks to kill lawfuls (pets, alarm traps, etc). To see the platinum girdle becoming about dirty tricks is... well, wrong. Personally I don't get what was wrong with it being exclusive and rare before, considering the high reward.
You hit a nerve. How about a new RFE with some simple but creative added complexity for gaining the girdle?

The reason I broke in is that ADOM really used the "global kill counter" internally which also includes all accidental kills, etc. (e.g. a lawful stepping on a trap somewhere or monsters accidentally getting into a hazzle). That really seemed more like "roll a 10.000-sided die and on a 1 you can get the girdle".

12-12-2012 05:03 PM
Ancient Member
Jeez ppl ask for something and when it gets implemented they cry about it. Must TB now bump every RFE and ask whether everyone is still fine with it?

I suggest you guys read all the RFE's and if you do not agree, then comment appropriately. Will save time and frustration.

12-12-2012 05:13 PM
Ancient Member
I voted against the feature when the RFE was posted. And hell, it was suggested months ago, long long before any of us thought these balance requests would ever be addressed.

05-14-2013 07:15 AM
Ancient Member
Quote Originally Posted by adom-admin
Now only PC kills count.
This is the only condition now, I think. I seriously think we should attempt to make it stricter.

By creating another RFE of course.

+ Reply